Any update on the source code availability for IPY for ASP.Net? Adam On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 3:11 PM, Jimmy Schementi < jimmy.scheme...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> I completely agree with your points; we have a finite amount of resources > and choose to focus on language compatibility over .NET web-stack > integration. Though IronPython has done that web-work in the past, we’re > purely focused on compat. I’ve forwarded on the previous mail to the > ASP.NET team; I want to see IronPython and IronRuby be used on the web > more too. =) > > > > That being said, *I’ve just finished packaging up > Microsoft.Web.Scripting.dll that works against the released IronPython 2 > Beta 1, and I’ll be releasing it either today to tomorrow* … so end of > conversation? =P Na, I this is a good conversation to have, but in short > you’ll be able to use IronPython 2 Beta 1 in ASP.NET very soon again. > Hopefully the next beta of IronPython 2.6 will include the DLL and source, > otherwise I’ll make this package again. > > > > ~js > > > > *From:* Dody Gunawinata [mailto:empirebuil...@gmail.com] > *Sent:* Thursday, May 21, 2009 4:23 AM > *To:* Jimmy Schementi > *Cc:* Discussion of IronPython > *Subject:* Re: [IronPython] IronPython for ASP.Net > > > > The refresh was unusable because it contained the version of IronPyton that > is not compatible with .Net 3.5 framework (I think it was built on IP 2.0 > Beta 3/4); > > I'm griping about this issue in this list because I don't think this is a > completely separate issue from the DLR programming languages. Maybe it is > not a direct responsibility of this team, but the impact is direct for the > following reasons: > > - Nobody adopts a language as is. The libraries matters. The existing > community of Python and Ruby are not going to move to Windows platform just > because IronPython and IronRuby are being worked on and released. They have > had a multi platform runtimes with de facto standards that are capable of > doing wonderful things for more than a decade. > - There is much bigger market for language adoption for existing > .Net/Windows based developers (and new developers) and these guys/gals are > using mostly standard Microsoft stacks. And they are using .Net via mainly > C# and VB.Net. If the DLR languages do not have proper support at least for > the major technology stacks (I would consider ASP.Net/Silverlight as major > stacks), many people will not consider using the DLR based language for > their production systems. > - I know ASP.Net MVC is open source and it's free to be extended etc, > but ASP.Net WebForm have be en deployed massively and that's not going to > change anytime soon. And theres is already a support, albeit poor and not > up > to date, for ASP.Net webform stacks in IronPython. Not having it fully > updated is a waste of opportunity. > - .Net 4.0 and C# vNext contains dynamic language support but really, > what is good for if the DLR languages can only be used in much more limited > scenarios because some major technology stacks are not supported. > - You raised correctly that Django and RoR are being used to validate > the languages. But I would argue that the existing technology stack > support > validates the DLR platform, not just the languages. > > So yes, I'm not happy with the level of investment being put on supporting > the technology stacks because I think it is pretty short sighted. No, I > don't blame this team for this but at least if I complain on this list, it > might have a chance being forwarded internally because this is one of the > best community mailing list for Microsoft technologies. > > Dody Gunawinata > > On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 5:17 AM, Jimmy Schementi < > jimmy.scheme...@microsoft.com> wrote: > > First off, it hasn’t been three years: a refresh was released 8 months ago, > and sent to this very list: > > > http://lists.ironpython.com/pipermail/users-ironpython.com/2008-September/008497.html > > > > Secondly, rather than just producing these one off releases (where are very > taxing on the team), we’re doing it right and getting the source code > released and Ms-Pl’d, so we can include it on Codeplex sources, builds, and > nightly builds. Then it can be included in each IronPython release, just > like Silverlight binaries are. > > > > Lastly, IronRuby and IronPython are programming languages, made by > programming language teams. We’re very interested in running as many > existing Ruby and Python programs as possible. It just so happens that > Django and Rails are popular, complex pieces of software that help find > bugs, and give the languages street cred for running them. If those web > frameworks didn’t run, theirs probably something wrong with our language. > > > > Running in ASP.NET and MVC require a significant amount of work *outside*of > the language, so it really isn’t a language team’s purpose to build that. > Sure they provide good demos as conferences or blog posts, but they’ll only > be toys. We’ve invested in those technologies before, which is why the > ASP.NET and Silverlight integration exists, but no one is working on > enabling web-technologies full-time (though I have spurts of diving back > into Silverlight from time to time). If you don’t like the level of > investment in dynamic languages for Microsoft web technologies, that’s > something that you should communicate to the ASP.NET team; Phil Haack ( > http://www.haacked.com) or Dmitry Robsman (http://blogs.msdn.com/dmitryr) > are good people to address. > > > > ~Jimmy > > > > *From:* users-boun...@lists.ironpython.com [mailto: > users-boun...@lists.ironpython.com] *On Behalf Of *Dody Gunawinata > *Sent:* Wednesday, May 20, 2009 1:22 PM > *To:* Discussion of IronPython > *Subject:* [IronPython] IronPython for ASP.Net > > > > Is there any update for IronPython for ASP.Net? > > > > It has been three years since IronPython support for ASP.Net introduced > with the release of the whitepaper ( > http://www.asp.net/DynamicLanguages/whitepaper/) and the first binary. > Since then I think we've had Katrina, a Beijing Olympic, a new President, a > financial collapse and two James Bond movies - yet until now there is still > no up to date support for the technology. I know that the legal team, etc > are working on the source release, but I think it is pretty galling that > Microsoft's own web framework stack is barely supported by its own dynamic > language technology, both on the 'classic' ASP.Net and MVC stack. I mean > there is more energy put into having IronPython and IronRuby to run Django > and RubyOnRails web framework instead of ASP.Net stack. This just doesn't > make sense to me. > > -- > nomadlife.org > > > > > -- > nomadlife.org > > _______________________________________________ > Users mailing list > Users@lists.ironpython.com > http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com > > -- Adam Brand Managing Partner SilverKey Technologies Direct: +1-312-239-6722 Main: +1-312-951-7525 Skype: adamsilverkey Email: ad...@silverkeytech.com www.silverkeytech.com
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