> -----Original Message-----
> If an application has 3 tiers: presentation, business, 
> backend - in which of
> those would you put the JSF Model (the Backing Beans?)

Usual answer: depends... ;-)

> 
> When I read through the www, I have to assume that it belongs in the
> business tier while the "rest" of the "JSF stuff" belongs into the
> presentation tier, right?

I often subdivide the managed beans in two groups:
- the usecase beans
and
- the model beans

I allow the usecase beans to depend on javax.faces.**.* classes but the
model
beans must be kept clean. The usecase beans are used to control the flow
within the usecase. The model beans are pure data-keeper.

It has worked in a medium-complex application, but I consider it as
"just
ONE working" model...

> 
> But if you want a "good" architecture - shouldn't there be 
> some sort of
> interface or facade centralizing the business tier access? (Like: all
> requests go through one gate?)

For this we request that all usecase-beans make requests from the
backend
(persistency,...) through facades. Those facades are not allowed to have
framework-dependencies. They use services, which depend on the 
backend-frameworks to get at the actual data. Usually they return 
the model-beans from above...

> Does anyone have a good JSF based architecture in UML (easier 
> to talk about
> a diagram instead of trying to describe it with words)

Not yet ;-)

hth (at least (new?) ideas...)
Alexander

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