Bottom line: Mark Goldes is assuming it's the same group of guys and therefore, don't bother with it! -Mark Iverson
-----Original Message----- From: Mark Goldes [mailto:mgol...@chavaenergy.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 4:10 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Perpetual motion machine This is almost certainly the same group of scammers. They keep changing the device and the device is easily faked in a video. Mark Mark Goldes Co-founder, Chava Energy CEO, Aesop Institute 301A North Main Street Sebastopol, CA 95472 www.chavaenergy.com www.aesopinstitute.org 707 861-9070 707 497-3551 fax ________________________________________ From: James Bowery [jabow...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 4:00 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Perpetual motion machine These are not indictments of the device in the video I cited. Is device in that video, whether or not legitimately claimed by Magniwork, Lutec or others, a device that has been shown to be incapable of self-sustaining motion? If it has been so shown, where is the demonstration of that fact? On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 5:02 PM, Mark Goldes <mgol...@chavaenergy.com<mailto:mgol...@chavaenergy.com>> wrote: They keep changing but here are a few of the stories... http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Buyer_Beware Magniwork Feature: Electromagnetic / Buyer Beware > Magniwork > Open letter to Clickbank regarding Magniwork scam involvement -- Warning of possible legal action - For the past year, Magniwork and others have been using Clickbank to sell $49 DIY plans for a device alleged to cost less than $100 in parts and which can power a house. Clickbank continues to allow this to go on, despite our warnings that the plans are bogus and that we've received no evidence to support the claim. (PESN; May 24, 2010) Electromagnetic > Magniwork > Magniwork Energy internet scam - Internet fraudsters are raking in thousands of dollars a day with a scam selling plans for what alleges to be an electromagnetic free energy machine capable of powering a house. One estimate puts sales of the guide as high as 5,000 copies a month, making the scam worth up to $3m a year. (Off-Grid; Oct. 8, 2009) [We've not yet received a scrap of evidence supporting the claims.] Featured: Buyer Beware > Electromagnetic > Magniwork > ACTION: Report Magniwork (Scam) Ads to Google and Clickbank - Easy steps presented for you to be able to lodge a complaint about the fraudsters who are selling plans for what alleges to be an inexpensive electromagnetic free energy machine capable of powering a house, though no supporting evidence has been given. Let's stop these hucksters who prey on the free energy believers and give the field a bad name. (PESWiki; Nov. 5, 2009) Buyer Beware > Electromagnetic > Magniwork > Lutec Disavows Magniwork - Lutec posted the following notice on their home page in a marquee text: [all caps] "Be Warned - 'Magniwork' is not related in any way to Lutec Australia, doe not sell plans for our equipment and is not authorized to use our videos on their site!" (PESWiki; Nov. 10, 2009) Featured: Electromagnetic > Bedini SG > Magniwork free energy plans = bogus claim; say they'll remedy that - Magniwork has been selling a set of plans for a free energy device they say could be scaled to power an entire house. However, it turns out that the device is nothing more than the Bedini SG circuit, which, though interesting, has never been embodied in a self-looped system with energy left over for practical use. They've apologized and removed the Bedini stuff. (PESWiki; June 2, 2009) Mark Mark Goldes Co-founder, Chava Energy CEO, Aesop Institute 301A North Main Street Sebastopol, CA 95472 www.chavaenergy.com<http://www.chavaenergy.com> www.aesopinstitute.org<http://www.aesopinstitute.org> 707 861-9070<tel:707%20861-9070> 707 497-3551<tel:707%20497-3551> fax ________________________________________ From: James Bowery [jabow...@gmail.com<mailto:jabow...@gmail.com>] Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 2:57 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com<mailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com> Subject: Re: [Vo]:Perpetual motion machine It looks very similar to the device currently under discussion in that it has a ramp of magnets with a discontinuity at the full cycle. Are they the same scam? Where can one read about the "well known scam"? On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 4:52 PM, Mark Goldes <mgol...@chavaenergy.com<mailto:mgol...@chavaenergy.com><mailto:mgoldes@chav aenergy.com<mailto:mgol...@chavaenergy.com>>> wrote: That site is the latest version of a well known scam. Mark Goldes Co-founder, Chava Energy CEO, Aesop Institute 301A North Main Street Sebastopol, CA 95472 www.chavaenergy.com<http://www.chavaenergy.com><http://www.chavaenergy.com> www.aesopinstitute.org<http://www.aesopinstitute.org><http://www.aesopinstit ute.org> 707 861-9070<tel:707%20861-9070><tel:707%20861-9070> 707 497-3551<tel:707%20497-3551><tel:707%20497-3551> fax ________________________________________ From: James Bowery [jabow...@gmail.com<mailto:jabow...@gmail.com><mailto:jabow...@gmail.com<mai lto:jabow...@gmail.com>>] Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 2:49 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com<mailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com><mailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com<m ailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com>> Subject: Re: [Vo]:Perpetual motion machine The video at this site clearly shows accelleration. http://diymagneticmotor.com/ That pretty much rules out the "low friction" argument. On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Harry Veeder <hveeder...@gmail.com<mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com><mailto:hveeder000@gmail.c om<mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com>><mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com<mailto:hveeder0 0...@gmail.com><mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com<mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com>>>> wrote: According to standard physics, it is impossible to design a magnetic motor that won't get stuck after a few turns. Therefore, questions about how much was energy was needed to assemble the device distract from the real significance of the demonstration. Either this is a hoax OR the device is really able to overcome the sticking problem and turn indefinitely. harry On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 1:33 PM, James Bowery <jabow...@gmail.com<mailto:jabow...@gmail.com><mailto:jabow...@gmail.com<mai lto:jabow...@gmail.com>><mailto:jabow...@gmail.com<mailto:jabow...@gmail.com ><mailto:jabow...@gmail.com<mailto:jabow...@gmail.com>>>> wrote: > Has anyone tried to do any arithmetic here? > > I mean to even an order of magnitude? > > On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 12:21 PM, Harry Veeder <hveeder...@gmail.com<mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com><mailto:hveeder000@gmail.c om<mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com>><mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com<mailto:hveeder0 0...@gmail.com><mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com<mailto:hveeder...@gmail.com>>>> wrote: >> >> Assuming no hidden power sources, the assumption is the work done >> repeatedly lifting the magnets (and the rod at the side) will >> eventually exceed the energy required to place the magnets in their >> starting position. >> >> Harry >> >> On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 3:31 AM, Teslaalset >> <robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com<mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com><mail >> to:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com<mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com>><m >> ailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com<mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com> >> <mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com<mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.co >> m>>>> >> wrote: >> > This stuff is quite misleading. >> > One has to put energy in first to get the moving magnet into its >> > starting position. >> > So there is no energy gain. >> > >> >
