If we could somehow create such a good and engaging game that money in our "game" could somehow be valuable enough that Europeans and Americans would buy it from Asian gold farmers who were doing lots of routine updating, or sophisticated editing for that matter, on Wikipedia I wouldn't see that as a bad outcome.
To expand that idea, if substantial routine editing on Wikipedia resulted in payment of a few hundred dollars a month, and we chose to finance that, it would be a sort of wealth transfer to the developing world. And be an international educational mechanism to a certain extent. Sorry to not address your comment more directly... Fred > In addition to gender (politics), recruiting more gamers to Wikimedia > content and communities may have different cultural and political impacts > for Asian regions. Note that although the users from Asian regions are > not > yet the predominant group of Wikimedia content and communities in > general, > the largest group of new online users are from these regions. We may want > to reconsider how the actual gamers are like in these regions, and what > kind of the games they are playing. > > The state-supported game industries by South Korea and China have raised > some concerns on the rise of "techno-nationalism" . > http://www.com.cuhk.edu.hk/c-centre/pdf/Game_Jiang.pdf It is thus also > important to see how gaming culture may intensify inter-nation or > inter-cultural conflicts. > > So going back to the original question (and assumptions) that open this > thread of discussion: > > There are many video game players of diverse ages, genders, languages, > and > locations. How could Wikimedia editing be made into an appealing activity > for people who are currently video gamers? How could Wikimedia market > itself to gamers, including console, LAN, FPS, MMORPG, and mobile gamers? > > > Note that it is explicitly assumed that many video game players are of > diverse ages, genders, languages and locations. I think it is an open > question. Another open question is how Wikimedia communities compare to > diverse of game platforms in terms of age, gender, language, geography > diversities. It is also prudent to dis-aggregate the big umbrella terms > such as Wikimedia projects and the world games without concrete case > studies. > > Still, I share the belief the promotion and advocacy of Wikimedia content > editorship and readership. As *cultural references* and *open-content > resources*, I personally believe that Wikimedia should advocate (instead > of > market) the sharing and making of game-related content, references and > resources. > > In Chinese Wikipedia, there are users who learn the basic concepts of > copyleft through making and re-purposing the East Asian animation/game > culture. It is NOT an accident that Chinese Wikipedia picks up the > unofficial Wikipe-tan or Wiki-girl (made by a Japanese called Kasuga) > during and after the China's "Green Dam Youth Escort" debacle. > > For images of Wikipe-tan or Wiki-girl > https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Green+dam+Chinese+Wikipedia&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=NGXaUdnLM8qI0AXd4oGQAQ&biw=1241&bih=601&sei=OmXaUcWXD8WY0AWQoYCACA#um=1&hl=en&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=%E7%B6%AD%E5%9F%BA%E5%A8%98&oq=%E7%B6%AD%E5%9F%BA%E5%A8%98&gs_l=img.3...3188.5996.2.6600.4.4.0.0.0.0.100.242.3j1.4.0...0.0.0..1c.4.17.img.3cuhpmRQk6Y&bav=on.2,or.r_qf.&bvm=bv.48705608,d.d2k&fp=17fa42ee51c9d6af&biw=1241&bih=601&facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=kd2hZH3UHVtRNM%3A%3BMJ3vS2ruNNaA7M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fww3.sinaimg.cn%252Flarge%252F6f42474fjw6dfl5obh159j.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.fuwoo.com%252FOneWord%252FList%252F35133%253Fkey%253D%2526pageIndex%253D74%3B974%3B562 > > > Thus, I think there is some space there to reassert the power and > possibilities of open cultural references and resources when it comes to > reaching out the gamers. Through more open sharing and creation of > game-related content, Wikimedia norms may even help to influence games as > we know today. > > Best, > han-teng liao > > > > > > 2013/7/8 Han-Teng Liao <hant...@gmail.com> > >> Citation needed?! >> >> >> http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=R__hfWbE3DwC&lpg=PA193&dq=East%20Asian%20online%20gaming%20male&hl=zh-TW&pg=PA193#v=onepage&q=East%20Asian%20online%20gaming%20male&f=false >> >> "Since online gamers are a predominantly male group of excessive >> internet >> users, they may be the cause of identified gender gaps. Most studies in >> this area orginate in East Asia ...." >> >> >> Note that the Chinese Wikipedia has a strong presence of Animations, >> Comics and Games (ACG) group contributors that are young, predominantly >> male. There is some cultural conflicts when some ACG contributors use >> East >> Asian ACG-only vocabulary and cultural references to general audience >> of >> editors in the village pump. >> >> Thus, the Wikipedia gaming question is beyond just interface, we may >> also >> consider the existing demographics (using language version as unit of >> analysis) and their social and cultural environments. >> >> For example, it would be interesting to see how far "gaming" as a >> category >> has developed across language versions and how such development >> correlates >> to gender ratio. >> >> For example, based on Chinese Wikipedia and Baidu Baike (Chinese >> Wikipedia's competitor hosted by Baidu the search engine), the contrast >> is >> clear. Note that Baide Baike deployed a point-based system with sort of >> role-playing categories that sound like online games. It corresponds to >> the >> labour-intensive but subject to potential manipulation of the metric >> system. Some Chinese Wikipedians think it is a good practice while some >> other think it makes the editorial processes stray away from productive >> editing. >> >> I understand that the gaming industry is big and its market growing and >> thus may open doors for more contribution and readership of Wikipedia. >> However, it is critical to examine and think through how games can >> change >> Wikipedia, and more importantly, how Wikipedia can change games. >> >> >> 2013/7/7 Kerry Raymond <kerry.raym...@gmail.com> >> >>> I believe women are well-represented (possibly even the majority) in >>> casual gaming.**** >>> >>> ** ** >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> *From:* wiki-research-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto: >>> wiki-research-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] *On Behalf Of *Han-Teng >>> Liao >>> *Sent:* Sunday, 7 July 2013 7:43 PM >>> >>> *To:* Research into Wikimedia content and communities >>> *Cc:* e...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> *Subject:* Re: [Wiki-research-l] Recruiting gamers to edit >>> Wikimedia**** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> Will this move (inviting gamers to contribute to Wikipedia in >>> "gamified" >>> interfaces) further skew the gender demographics of Wikipedia >>> contributors? >>> Is there any alternative that provide customized interfaces that are >>> more >>> inviting to existing gender-balanced or even female-dominant >>> sub-cultural >>> groups?**** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> 2013/7/7 ENWP Pine <deyntest...@hotmail.com>**** >>> >>> Hi Quim and Sarah, >>> >>> I should have worded my question more precisely. I'm asking what >>> Wikimedia could do to recruit people who play video games on various >>> platforms and in various types of games (casual, FPS, MMPORG, and so >>> on) so >>> that they convert the time they currently use for gaming into time >>> spent >>> contributing to Wikimedia projects of any kind or subject rather than >>> on >>> the important but narrower subject of video games. For example, what >>> would >>> it take to convert people who currently play crossword puzzles or >>> Scrabble >>> on their smartphones into editors of Wiktionary? What would it take to >>> convert people who play geocaching into photo contributors to Commons? >>> What >>> would it take to convert FPS gamers into NPP or anti-vandalism >>> editors? >>> >>> The people on the Research list are generating a lot of good >>> discussion >>> about gamification within Wikimedia to encourage more and higher >>> quality >>> participation, and we're also discussing how to recruit gamers to >>> become >>> new Wikimedia contributors. Please come over to the thread on >>> Research-l >>> and let's continue talking there. (: >>> >>> Pine**** >>> >>> >>> > Date: Fri, 05 Jul 2013 07:31:17 -0700 >>> > From: Quim Gil <q...@wikimedia.org> >>> > To: e...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> > Subject: Re: [EE] Recruiting gamers to edit Wikimedia >>> > Message-ID: <51d6d8b5.4040...@wikimedia.org> >>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed**** >>> >>> >>> > >>> > On 07/04/2013 12:46 PM, ENWP Pine wrote: >>> > > I've asked these questions in other ways and places and I'd like >>> to >>> hear >>> > > what other people on the Research and EE lists think. >>> > > >>> > > There are many video game players of diverse ages, genders, >>> languages, >>> > > and locations. How could Wikimedia editing be made into an >>> appealing >>> > > activity for people who are currently video gamers? How could >>> Wikimedia**** >>> >>> > > market itself to gamers, including console, LAN, FPS, MMORPG, and >>> mobile >>> > > gamers? >>> > >>> > Have you asked at >>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Video_games ? >>> > >>> > (as an outsider) I would say that gaming in general is pretty well >>> > covered, at least in comparison with other areas of knowledge. Or >>> what >>> > would be the reason to target gamers? >>> > >>> > Editing per se is not the problem. There is no lack of gamers using >>> > wikis (and MediaWiki!) e.g. http://www.wikia.com/ or >>> > http://www.minecraftwiki.net/ . The average gamer probably gets the >>> idea >>> > of crowdsourcing knowledge pretty well. Those wikis are community >>> wikis >>> > though, as an editor you won't need to deal (much) with relevance, >>> > references, POV, essay, etc. I don't know what are the conditions to >>> > upload copyrighted content but probably these wikis are more >>> permissive >>> > than Wikimedia's. >>> > >>> > Well, I guess >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Move_to_gaming_wiki >>> > exists for a reason. Maybe if we would send gamers (also) to >>> > http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Subject:Games we could keep a bit more >>> > talent around... >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Quim Gil >>> > Technical Contributor Coordinator @ Wikimedia Foundation >>> > http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Qgil >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >>> > Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2013 08:26:14 -0700 >>> > From: Sarah Stierch <sstie...@wikimedia.org> >>> > To: WMF Editor Engagement Team <e...@lists.wikimedia.org> >>> > Subject: Re: [EE] Recruiting gamers to edit Wikimedia >>> > Message-ID: >>> > <cafk0ehvocyv-n5kmchop-c0r7wy649adxmdhg5u+cvbjgha...@mail.gmail.com> >>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >>> > >>> > Hi, >>> > >>> > And yes, if you're interested in engaging (or re engaging) with >>> people >>> > already in the community or who don't edit as frequently perhaps, >>> you >>> can >>> > contact people who have userboxes on English Wikipedia saying they >>> are >>> into >>> > video games: >>> > >>> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Userboxes/Games/Video_games >>> > >>> > I do this for women's history projects and programs. I either use >>> > EdwardsBot and spam them with a template inviting them to something >>> or >>> > whatever, or invite them individually (more time consuming of >>> course). >>> > >>> > Sarah >>> > >>> > >>> > On Fri, Jul 5, 2013 at 7:31 AM, Quim Gil <q...@wikimedia.org> >>> wrote:*** >>> * >>> >>> >>> > >>> > > On 07/04/2013 12:46 PM, ENWP Pine wrote: >>> > > >>> > >> I've asked these questions in other ways and places and I'd like >>> to >>> hear >>> > >> what other people on the Research and EE lists think. >>> > >> >>> > >> There are many video game players of diverse ages, genders, >>> languages, >>> > >> and locations. How could Wikimedia editing be made into an >>> appealing >>> > >> activity for people who are currently video gamers? How could >>> Wikimedia**** >>> >>> > >> market itself to gamers, including console, LAN, FPS, MMORPG, and >>> mobile >>> > >> gamers? >>> > >> >>> > > >>> > > Have you asked at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/** >>> > > Wikipedia:WikiProject_Video_**games< >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Video_games>? >>> > > >>> > > (as an outsider) I would say that gaming in general is pretty well >>> > > covered, at least in comparison with other areas of knowledge. Or >>> what >>> > > would be the reason to target gamers? >>> > > >>> > > Editing per se is not the problem. There is no lack of gamers >>> using >>> wikis >>> > > (and MediaWiki!) e.g. http://www.wikia.com/ or >>> > > http://www.minecraftwiki.net/ . The average gamer probably gets >>> the >>> idea >>> > > of crowdsourcing knowledge pretty well. Those wikis are community >>> wikis >>> > > though, as an editor you won't need to deal (much) with relevance, >>> > > references, POV, essay, etc. I don't know what are the conditions >>> to >>> upload >>> > > copyrighted content but probably these wikis are more permissive >>> than >>> > > Wikimedia's. >>> > > >>> > > Well, I guess >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Template:Move_to_gaming_wiki< >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Move_to_gaming_wiki>exists for a >>> reason. Maybe if we would send gamers (also) to >>> > > http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/**Subject:Games< >>> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Subject:Games>we could keep a bit more >>> talent around... >>> > > >>> > > -- >>> > > Quim Gil >>> > > Technical Contributor Coordinator @ Wikimedia Foundation >>> > > http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/**User:Qgil< >>> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Qgil> >>> > > >>> > > ______________________________**_________________ >>> > > EE mailing list >>> > > e...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/ee< >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/ee> >>> > > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > *Sarah Stierch** >>> > Wikimedia Foundation Program Evaluation & Design Community >>> Coordinator >>> > *Donate< >>> http://wikimediafoundation.org/w/index.php?title=Donate/en&utm_source=&utm_medium=&utm_campaign=&language=en&uselang=en&country=US&referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Furl%3Fsa%3Dt%26rct%3Dj%26q%3D%26esrc%3Ds%26source%3Dweb%26cd%3D1%26ved%3D0CDMQFjAA%26url%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fdonate.wikipedia.org%252F%26ei%3DYpsET93HN6isiQLIoJjSDg%26usg%3DAFQjCNG-7hzT9rkEvAjlNqBIOQ1ZDIpdYA >>> >today >>> > and keep it free! >>> > >>> > Visit me on Wikipedia >>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:SarahStierch >>> >!**** >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wiki-research-l mailing list >>> Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l**** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wiki-research-l mailing list >>> Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l >>> >>> >> > _______________________________________________ > Wiki-research-l mailing list > Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l > _______________________________________________ Wiki-research-l mailing list Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l
