Context: reduced traffic on wikimedia-l. Is this a sign of poor community health? To what extent has community energy and activity moved to other fora? Is list activity (for certain lists) a useful measure of activity and enthusiasm (about certain parts of the projects)?
On Thu, Jun 4, 2015 at 7:18 AM, Aaron Halfaker <aaron.halfa...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Pine, > > Can you provide us with a quick summary of the start of this conversation > and what the " these kinds of questions " might be? > > Thanks! > -Aaron > > On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 10:04 AM, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Speaking of specialized lists, I'd like to suggest that this discussion >> would be well suited to Research-l, where many people who are interested in >> these kinds of questions read and write about them more frequently than >> they do on Wikimedia-l. I'm boldly adding that list to the recipients for >> this thread. >> >> I have some thoughts about the substance of this discussion but they're a >> bit rushed at the moment. I may write more later. >> >> Regards, >> Pine >> On Jun 2, 2015 4:32 AM, "Milos Rancic" <mill...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Luis, I have to say that you are the first person on WMF side who has >>> substantially engaged into this issue and I am very glad to see that :) >>> >>> The products of your work are of the highest importance, as the community >>> is the most important part of our movement, not to say that it's the >>> movement itself. >>> >>> I am finally relieved to know that we are on the path to rationally >>> understand what's going on inside of the community after short 14.5 >>> years. >>> >>> It would be good if you'd share your results with the rest of us. >>> >>> As for this list: As MZ said, this list is important. However, there is >>> no >>> doubt that it's far from being the only or even the most important >>> indicator of community health. It is just about one of the rare publicly >>> accessible data which could give a clue of what's going on inside of the >>> community, but could mislead, as well. >>> On Jun 2, 2015 04:39, "Luis Villa" <lvi...@wikimedia.org> wrote: >>> >>> > On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 10:57 AM, Milos Rancic <mill...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> > >>> > > On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 7:51 PM, Luis Villa <lvi...@wikimedia.org> >>> wrote: >>> > > > On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 9:26 AM, Andrew Lih <andrew....@gmail.com> >>> > wrote: >>> > > > >>> > > >> 3. Participation in the mailing list may be a misleading >>> indicator of >>> > > >> activity or interest, as other regional or specialized forums (eg. >>> > > >> Facebook, GLAM-oriented lists, etc) have emerged in recent years. >>> > > >> >>> > > > >>> > > > Let me second this. My department is thinking about community >>> health >>> > > > metrics (constructive suggestions welcome!), but I would not >>> personally >>> > > > propose mailing list participation (especially this list) as a good >>> > > metric >>> > > > - decreased participation here may reflect many, many things, only >>> some >>> > > of >>> > > > which are actually negative. >>> > > >>> > > This is not the only one indicator, but it's pretty consistent since >>> > > 2011 (take a look into [1]). In other words, something happened in >>> > > May. Maybe it's actually about the elections because people used >>> other >>> > > means of communication for that. >>> > > >>> > >>> > Looking briefly at some of the highest-traffic months, it could simply >>> be >>> > that people got tired of discussing high-controversy topics here. >>> > (Flamewars are good for traffic volume; not so great for community >>> health.) >>> > I'm sure Facebook's increased acceptance also has a role. I suspect >>> also >>> > that some announcements that used to come here now go to other, more >>> > specialized mailing lists. >>> > >>> > That last one points to a key thing: as MZ says, many people are >>> subscribed >>> > to this list, but many don't read and don't participate, because this >>> > mailing list has an *awful* reputation, and people who want to get >>> things >>> > done are going elsewhere. So "the decline of wikimedia-l" may be a >>> sign of >>> > bad health of the overall community, or it may simply mean that the >>> healthy >>> > and constructive parts of the community has moved elsewhere. >>> > >>> > To re-iterate what I said in the last email, I'm all ears for >>> suggestions >>> > on creative community metrics. I'll add here that I'm also very open to >>> > suggestions on what a new wikimedia-l might look like. (I know some >>> FOSS >>> > communities are having good experiences with discourse.org, for >>> example.) >>> > No commitment that WMF can act on either immediately, of course, but I >>> > think it is worth starting both of those discussions. >>> > >>> > Luis >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Luis Villa >>> > Sr. Director of Community Engagement >>> > Wikimedia Foundation >>> > *Working towards a world in which every single human being can freely >>> share >>> > in the sum of all knowledge.* >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: >>> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines >>> > wikimedi...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, >>> > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines >>> wikimedi...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/guidelineswikimedi...@lists.wikimedia.org> >>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, >>> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wiki-research-l mailing list >> Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Wiki-research-l mailing list > Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l > > -- Samuel Klein @metasj w:user:sj +1 617 529 4266
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