Hoi,
We do not care about our own. I do acknowledge that some have other
opinions but I do not have to respect such an opinion. The proof of the
pudding is after all in the eating and we allowed this to happen, no sound
came out of our community that said otherwise.
The fact of the matter is observable. When you compare it with fake news;
please tell me what did we do? How did we show that we cared?
Thanks,
GerardM
On 11 February 2017 at 15:47, Romaine Wiki <romaine.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > because it has proven that we do not care about our own.
>
> Besides this is complete nonsense, that the discussion goes in this way it
> proofs we fail in being able to have a mature discussion on arguments and
> not emotions.
>
> And claiming this kind of nonsense like "we do not care about our own"
> shows a complete disrespect to those who have a different opinion.
>
> This kind of messages are the core of the problem: writing claims that are
> not supported by any evidence. Conclusion: it are fake claims, strongly
> related to the *fake news* subject of the past weeks. The thing that is
> proven is that some people in our movement spread fake information.
>
> And for clarity reasons: a friend of mine is affected. If I consider a
> banner is not suitable, would that make me then not caring? Totally not.
>
>
> 2017-02-07 8:01 GMT+01:00 Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com>:
>
> > Hoi,
> > Credibility like quality is a two edged sword. When the suggestion is
> that
> > we lose credibility, the question is to whom and also is that not exactly
> > the point. When we take a stance or when we do not take a stance it has
> > consequences.
> >
> > The huha with no banner for Bassel has cost our community because it has
> > proven that we do not care about our own.
> > Thanks,
> > GerardM
> >
> > On 7 February 2017 at 00:37, Romaine Wiki <romaine.w...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > > To stay short and in addition of Seddon said: The more the Wikimedia
> > > movement/WMF chooses to pick a side by using a banner above all
> projects
> > > (like Wikipedia) - calling yes/no for a strike is taking a side - the
> > more
> > > it can loose credibility. For the same reason as we do not want
> > > advertisements, we do not want to take any sides, because that can
> > directly
> > > damage Wikipedia as being neutral, as well as being independent, and
> > more.
> > > Therefore banners for advocacy are not done.
> > >
> > > The only exception of having advocacy banners is in some exceptional
> > cases
> > > where all other efforts where insufficient, and the specific
> legislation
> > > would have with implementation a direct influence on the key principles
> > of
> > > Wikipedia (or other Wikimedia project). Even in such cases there need
> to
> > be
> > > a local team that is completely informed about the situation, that is
> in
> > > direct communication with the legal department of WMF, with a common
> > > understanding between them, with a clear timeline, community approval
> (!)
> > > and even then we need to be as neutral as possible, not calling for
> > action
> > > but informing why something would directly influence Wikipedia (etc).
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 2017-02-05 21:29 GMT+01:00 Bill Takatoshi <billtakato...@gmail.com>:
> > >
> > > > In the past two days I've been four off-list messages in response to
> > > > my request for proposed banner language, all but one from James
> > > > Salsman, who I recently defended here and who was subsequently
> "placed
> > > > on moderation." I asked moderator Richard Ames whether it would be
> > > > appropriate to forward his messages, and he said they should be sent
> > > > to the moderation queue. James then sent me a BCC of a very brief
> post
> > > > yesterday, which apparently has not yet been approved. James then
> sent
> > > > me, but not the list, arguments about the merits of the various
> > > > alternatives. I don't agree with the censorship, but in deference to
> > > > the moderator I am sending these links without James's commentary:
> > > >
> > > > http://i.imgur.com/3Fb8Zrr.png
> > > >
> > > > http://www.cosmopolitan.com/politics/a8671628/national-
> > > > strike-protest-president-donald-trump/
> > > >
> > > > https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/5s6ay6/
> > activists_call_for_a_
> > > > nationwide_strike_in_protest/ddctj1h/
> > > >
> > > > https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2017/01/
> > > > 31/wheres-the-best-place-to-resist-trump-at-work/
> > > >
> > > > https://www.thenation.com/article/throw-sand-in-the-
> > gears-of-everything/
> > > >
> > > > Another respondent who asked that I not use their name suggested that
> > > > an effective campaign can be patterned after this recent success:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/progressive-
> > > > activism-forces-uber-ceo-break-trump
> > > >
> > > > Could we please have banner text proposals do NOT call for a general
> > > > strike? I am not suggesting it be ruled out, nor am I suggesting that
> > > > we not join the call. I am simply asking for discussion in the middle
> > > > ground.
> > > >
> > > > -Will
> > > >
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