On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 10:50 AM C. Scott Ananian <canan...@wikimedia.org> wrote:
> Chad: the more you argue that it's not even worth considering, the more I'm > going to push back and ask for actual numbers and facts. ;) > > As I said in my prior message: it's been considered, and discarded rather quickly. It doesn't need much further introspection than that. A couple of major points: * Brian W's point is correct: there's not much migration cost at all moving to PHP7. Moving between PHP versions has always been pretty easy for us in MW--we write very conservative code as it is. * Various (there's lots from lots of people) benchmarks routinely show HHVM and PHP7--especially 7.1+--performance to be roughly on par, depending on workloads. We can get some firmer numbers here. ** A bunch of major projects have already dropped HHVM for PHP7+. Etsy, Symphony, Wordpress (they no longer test against it) * Swapping to HHVM/Hack would abandon many/most of our downstream users -- the stats Stas pointed to way far back shows world install base as well under 0.5% of all PHP runtimes. * Speaking of downstream users: HHVM has always been a second-class citizen on non-Linux OSes. It's always been wonky on OSX (I would know, I was the first person to ever get it built), and I don't think anyone's ever got it working on Windows outside of Cygwin--please correct me if I'm wrong? * It greatly complicates setup and development work for both WMF and volunteers. ** Did I mention almost nobody has up to date packages for this? * PHP has a long-documented history of working as a proper FLOSS project. Facebook's track record here has been less than stellar--it comes in fits and starts and there's a lot of "throwing code over the wall" ** We have a core PHP contributor (Stas) on this list. Other than occasional patches we've shipped upstream to HHVM, I doubt anyone would claim themselves a core HHVM contributor around here [maybe Tim early on, heh] * Choices HHVM is going to make upstream (references, destuctors) are a /huge/ issue for us. The former is basically a requirement for our Hooks system and the latter is used all over the dang place for profiling and other fun scope-based tricks. * Libraries we use -- composer, phpunit, etc can not be depended on to support Hack in the long term, and there's no tooling in the HHVM world for this (promises notwithstanding). -Chad _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
