So in otherwords Torrent shouldn't be an issue then from what you say. So no need to block or throttle it. Also sites like The Pirate Bay are insignificant because nobody uses Torrents. It's easy. Installed a Torrent client (utorrent, bittorent, limewire you name it) and when you run across a torrent offered download click the link torrent file download and download client is launched.
You might not see the use of it or like Nine Inch Nails, prefer to do it the hard way with WoW and prefer http downloads. All ISO *nix dists I downloaded been over torrent because I grew frustrated trying to find the one fast mirror with Torrent I frequently hit 800KBps downloads speeds no matter how new the release is. Plus on top of it I can help out the open source community by seeding the distro. I do NOT want to be a mirror because of the bandwidth utilizations and well honestly I do not have decent enough speed to be a "useful" mirror. And you forgot all other examples I provided that are legal Torrents providing broadcaster shows and podcasts some by broadcasters themselves. You wanted more examples besides wow, *nix distros and MikroTik and I gave it to you. You just said to you torrent was useless and to hard and you prefer web downloads and say that nobody else would use it so why then are we having the discussion about bittorrents and block, throttle or connection limit obviously it's not a uncommon occurrence/use. Legal or not downloads. Like it or not BitTorrent is here to stay and with every day there will be more legal use for it and illegal use will continue to be used. Blocking it or throttle it to unusable is not an option IMHO. Just like Napster it used to be for illegal downloads now it's not. If someone paid for a subscription on the Napster website and then downloaded the software client and find out his ISP is blocking it this guy ain't going to be happy. Say someone buys the Amazon S3 service to have a offsite synced data storage service and your blocking it and it takes this person/company hours to figure out that you're the blame I'm sure this business is not going to be happy. Nine Inch Nails have their official torrent provided through The Pirate Bay. So anyone using LimeWire as you say will access the official way of downloading the 2 last NIN albums (first one was a 4 cd album). And if you have installed Limewire/Kazza or whatever the gamer/mp3r is ready to download torrents with a single click of a webpage just as easy as you download a normal file through a http page but the advantage most of the times faster downloads..... / Eje -----Original Message----- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 3:09 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Mikrotik] bittorrents I never said it was good to block it. I think blocking it is bad. Not sure where you got that impression. My stance is if you can support it, charge them for it. If it costs you too much and you lose money on it, drop it with speed limiting, blocking or the customer entirely. Once again... I have played Wow. I played it last week for the free trial. Instead of waiting all night for the torrent I went to one of the mirrors I posted and got the patch in minutes instead of hours. Blizzard's other games - Starcraft, Warcraft 2 and 3, Diablo 1 and 2 - are all HTTP only. The only Blizzard files obtained via torrent are the Wow patches and hi def trailers/movies - < http://us.blizzard.com/support/article.xml?locale=en_US&tag=patches> Every *nix distro I've obtained (Ubuntu, Fedora, Centos, DSL, Knoppix, Gentoo, maybe more) I've done HTTP. Who cares if Nine Inch Nails distributes their music via torrent? No one uses it anyways - they all use Napster/Kazaa/Limewire. So why choose torrent over HTTP? I just don't see Grandma Bonnie Emailer or Little Timmy MP3er or Greasy Gary Gamer (except that one half Wow example) using torrents. I just don't see the average user installing utorrent to get their blog videos, mp3s or latest content, it's easier to click one link in the browser, save it and use it. I also want to mention that 300GB/mo transfer at home is not high at all. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." --- Winston Churchill On Sun, Feb 14, 2010 at 2:57 PM, Eje Gustafsson <e...@wisp-router.com> wrote: > Have you ever played wow and see how their updates are released and > distributed? (I'm not a wow player but I had to deal with it). Basically > you > start the game, login to your character and you get a notice update is > available and you say ok and it starts downloading and update starts once > it > is done. > > ISO distro downloads. Instead of hunting for a mirror site that have fast > speeds and testing out multiple of them before finding on that give you > good > speed. All I do is select one torrent file and start a torrent download. > ISO > downloaded in no time. Faster easier and less issues. Especially when you > deal with a big distro version that is DVD format and newly released. > > Other adoptions.... > BitTorrent Inc has a number of licenses from Hollywood for distributing > popular content with their torrent system > Sub Pop Records reelases tracks and videos to distribute its 1000+ albums. > The band Ween as an example uses the website Browntracker.net to distribute > hundreds of video recordings of live shows. > Babyshambles, The Libertines has extensively used torrents to distribute > hundreds of demos and live videos. > Nine Inch Nails frequently distribute albums via BitTorrent > Many new PodCasting software start to integrate BitTorrent to help > broadcasters deal with download demands of their MP3 "radio" programs. For > example Juice and Miro support automatic processing of .torrent files from > RSS feeds. The same thing with uTurrent. > Then you have Mininova tracker which is a Content Distributor only platform > to allow copyright holders especially smaller groups to distribute their > music, videos etc. > In addition DGM Live! Purchass are provided via BitTorrent > > CBC was the first public broadcaster in NA to make a full show available > for > download using BitTorrent > NRK (Norwegian Broadcasting Corporation) has since March 08 experimented > with bittorrent distribution for selected material which NRK owns all > royalties (they use Miro) (http://nrkbeta.no/bittorrent/) > VPRO (Dutch broadcaster) released some documentaries under the Creative > Commons license using Mininova. > > Amazon S3 (Simple Storage Service) is equipped with a built-in BitTorrent > support > Bog Torrent has a bittorent track to enable bloggers to host a tracker on > their site to allow visitors to download a stub loader so they can access > picture, blog, music, videos posted by the blogger. > > As mentioned Blizzard Entertainment (especially Wow) uses built in > BitTorrent in their software for updates, patches, maps etc downloads. Some > of these downloads are extremely large and difficult to host and distribute > of a traditional server because once a large update is released you will > have tens of thousands people that will download said update within hours. > Support nightmare to try to get everyone go to a mirror webpage and > download > a separate installer with no automatic and slow download speeds. > > Many open source and free software projects encourage BitTorrent basically > to increase availability and to reduce load on their own servers mostly > when > a new software release just been released. When you have hundreds or > thousands people that want to download latest dist. Personally I don't mind > to help seed a Fedora torrent because it helps me out when a new version is > available as well. > > So enough legal usages and samples for you now to still think it's ok to > totally block or throttle BitTorrent to nothingness? Your customers pay you > to get access to data what they access is after all really not your > responsibility. Yours is to provide them with access and ensure that they > have good access and get what they pay for which means control and maintain > network stability and speed by managing your traffic to a level that is > good > for everyone. The more people that blatantly block things and especially > when there is no other highspeed options will cause the FCC/government to > step in and enforce how things need to be ran and what you are allowed or > especially not allowed to do. But of course if your clean about it and very > upfront about it then it might be a different matter. But if your hide it > in > a AUP or TOS in the fine print especially if you don't make the user sign > it > but states usage of internet means acceptance of the terms you are in deep > waters. > I personally allow any fileshare application on my network. I do throttle > it > and only allow a max of 60% of my available bandwidth for fileshare apps > shared over all my customers and on top of it any interactive data > transfers > is prioritized (dns, mail, http, messengers to mention a few) above > fileshare. The advantage to this is that my customer can still download > things over fileshare and it will not kill their other usage nor my > available bandwidth either. Works nice for them and for me and everyone is > happy. > > / Eje > > -----Original Message----- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Josh Luthman > Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 12:44 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Mikrotik] bittorrents > > I'm not saying there aren't a lot of legal torrents but I'm saying the > majority are illegal and that torrent is by no means a mainstream protocol > that needs to be supported. > > Wow patches? Here's some HTTP mirrors... > http://www.wowwiki.com/Patch_mirrors > > MT updates? Click the link above it that is HTTP for the file you need. > > *nix distros? Click the HTTP links above or below it. > > These are the 3 examples I see time and time again and I always ask, > without > answer, for other examples. > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue > that counts." > --- Winston Churchill > > > On Sun, Feb 14, 2010 at 1:41 AM, Philip Dorr > <wirel...@judgementgaming.com>wrote: > > > I get my Ubuntu ISOs via Bittorrent. > > > > We block the customer, until they stop, if it is causing problems with > > the AP they are on. We have only had problems on our 2.4Ghz and > > sometimes 900Mhz APs. We have not yet had any problems on our 5.8Ghz > > APs. > > > > On Sun, Feb 14, 2010 at 12:09 AM, Josh Luthman > > <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote: > > > Torrents are used by WoW and Mikrotik. What else that you would go > > > under oath saying you torrented? > > > > > > On 2/14/10, Robert West <robert.w...@just-micro.com> wrote: > > >> We allow but they can't run a server, as in NO sharing. But > "allowing" > > >> means no 24 hour downloading. > > >> > > >> Can't get around torrents, even Mikrotik has their updates via > torrent. > > >> > > >> Bob- > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On > > >> Behalf Of RickG > > >> Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 12:55 AM > > >> To: WISPA General List > > >> Subject: [WISPA] bit torrents > > >> > > >> Even though our AUP & TOS does not allow it, I have a customer > > >> demanding to run bit torrents. I want to be fair in all matters. Am I > > >> being over > > >> zealous on not allowing torrents? Who here allows or disallows them? > > >> -RickG > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> ---- > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > >> http://signup.wispa.org/ > > >> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> ---- > > >> > > >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > >> > > >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > > >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > >> > > >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > >> http://signup.wispa.org/ > > >> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > > >> > > >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > >> > > >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > > >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > >> > > >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > >> > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Josh Luthman > > > Office: 937-552-2340 > > > Direct: 937-552-2343 > > > 1100 Wayne St > > > Suite 1337 > > > Troy, OH 45373 > > > > > > "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to > > > continue that counts." > > > --- Winston Churchill > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > > > WISPA Wants You! 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