James and Matt --> Comments below. ---- Alan C. Whiteman Visualis Web Design http://visualis.us (562) 305-2862 ___________________
On Saturday 10 January 2009 04:36:54 pm you wrote: > ********************************************************************* > WEB STANDARDS GROUP MAIL LIST DIGEST > ********************************************************************* > > > From: "James O'Neill" <freexe...@gmail.com> > Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 11:13:08 -0600 > Subject: Site Review: www.ItsAllaboutYou-studio.com > > Greetings everyone, > I just published this site: www.ItsAllAboutYou-Studio.com for my our Yoga > Studio to-be and I am curious for a critique. > Someone else came up with the design and I hand-coded this in Dreamweaver. > Tonight I will be applying Dean Edward's IE7/8, so, hopefully I can get rid > of some of those CSS hacks. =) It is still a little bit rough.... it will > work for now... > > I am also having someone put this up on Wordpress or Drupal. Let me know > what you think... > > This is the first critique I have asked for... I would love to hear any > questions, comments, suggestions, or improvements. > Your site looks fine in Firefox 3 under Linux. The font could be a tad smaller and then fill extra white space with decorative images. In the Locations page, the images at the bottom may be better arranged to show side by side. > *hides in a corner* > > Thanks all, > > Jim > > ______________________________________ > "All for one and one for all." > > www.ArionsHome.com (Persona BLog) > www.FreeXenon.com (Web Site Consulting) > www.ItsAllAboutYou-Studio.com (Our Yoga Studio) > > > ********************************************************************* > From: Matt Morgan-May <matt...@adobe.com> > Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 11:50:10 -0800 > Subject: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT > > Hi, > > Excuse me for jumping in here, especially (in this case) as a Flash > partisan. But I fail to see how this kind of project can be anything other > than a good thing overall. > > What I don't understand is why people are instantly critical of projects > that are actually attempting to increase access to new technology. Actually, people are critical of technologies that obfuscate accessibility. > I've > heard a constant drumbeat of "don't use Flash: it's inaccessible" in the > years I've been involved in the field. This is because Flash is primarily a medium preferred by advertisers and naive designers to make sites "entertaining" and end up creating pages that move, dance, pulse, flash, spin, shake, make noise, but do nothing more than create a ghastly annoying experience. In the end, Flash is not only an obnoxious medium in 90% of its usage, it's technically bad for SEO. > But if we don't have people pushing > that envelope, doesn't that make that statement self-fulfilling prophecy? As a proprietary technology, Adobe can have the burden of making its technology better and more compliant. > There are lots of us out there working on improving the accessibility of > both existing and future content authored in Flash. > > There are many arguments to be made for HTML -- I made loads of them while > working for W3C, all of which I would stand by today -- but it is not all > things to all people. I guess that nobody objects to Flash being a medium by which to build specific applications for education. But this does not require that Flash be accessible or SEO friendly, or splattered all over the web. > The fact is that many educators have found that they > can use Flash to teach their students effectively. I'm not an educator by > profession, but my wife is, and she prefers Flash over HTML/CSS/JS to > develop her courseware. This makes perfect sense. I only responded because I do prefer that Flash go away from the web- permanently. > If you were to tell her she's wrong, especially > before seeing what kind of work she does, I think you'd probably find > yourself dodging a couple shelves' worth of education texts. Telling a > professional their tools are wrong is not the most endearing of approaches. > In my opinion, the best one can do is to learn what they're doing, and offe > r > ways to make that output more efficient, more inclusive, and easier to > produce. > > Teachers aren't usually web developers, and we shouldn't want them to be. S > o > I'm all for companies taking on the technical problems so teachers can be > teachers, and so on. > > Thanks, > M > Accessibility Engineer, Adobe > > Christie Mason said: > > Exactly right. I've sadly watched Flash take over eLearning and still > > haven't figured out the attraction, except that it offers the control of > > PPT > > > while appearing to be "rich". There's only a very few types of web sit > > es > > > that still use Flash for delivering primary content - media sites, those > > that focus more on "look at me" instead of being a resource to their sit > > e > > > guests, and eLearning. > > > > Since, supposedly, eLearning is about offering web based resources for > > learning it just doesn't make sense to me that it has ignored all the way > > s > > > the web has supported, continues to support, learning w/o using Flash. > > Flash on the web is like cooking with garlic. A little adds depth, a lot > > is > > > inedible. > > ********************************************************************* > From: "Rick Faircloth" <r...@whitestonemedia.com> > Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 16:48:46 -0500 > Subject: RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT > > Agreed! > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On > > Behalf Of Matt > > Morgan-May > > > Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 2:50 PM > > To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org > > Subject: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT > > > > Hi, > > > > Excuse me for jumping in here, especially (in this case) as a Flash > > partisan. But I fail to see how this kind of project can be anything > > other than a good thing overall. > > > > What I don't understand is why people are instantly critical of projects > > that are actually attempting to increase access to new technology. I've > > heard a constant drumbeat of "don't use Flash: it's inaccessible" in the > > years I've been involved in the field. But if we don't have people > > pushing that envelope, doesn't that make that statement self-fulfilling > > prophecy? There are lots of us out there working on improving the > > accessibility of both existing and future content authored in Flash. > > > > There are many arguments to be made for HTML -- I made loads of them > > while working for W3C, all of which I would stand by today -- but it is > > not all things to all people. The fact is that many educators have found > > that they can use Flash to teach their students effectively. I'm not an > > educator by profession, but my wife is, and she prefers Flash over > > HTML/CSS/JS to develop her courseware. If you were to tell her she's > > wrong, especially before seeing what kind of work she does, I think you'd > > probably find yourself dodging a couple shelves' worth of education > > texts. Telling a professional their tools are wrong is not the most > > endearing of approaches. In my opinion, the best one can do is to learn > > what they're doing, and offer ways to make that output more efficient, > > more inclusive, and easier to produce. > > > > Teachers aren't usually web developers, and we shouldn't want them to be. > > So I'm all for companies taking on the technical problems so teachers can > > be teachers, and so on. > > > > Thanks, > > M > > Accessibility Engineer, Adobe > > > > Christie Mason said: > > > Exactly right. I've sadly watched Flash take over eLearning and still > > > haven't figured out the attraction, except that it offers the control > > > of PPT while appearing to be "rich". There's only a very few types > > > of web sites that still use Flash for delivering primary content - > > > media sites, those that focus more on "look at me" instead of being a > > > resource to their site guests, and eLearning. > > > > > > Since, supposedly, eLearning is about offering web based resources for > > > learning it just doesn't make sense to me that it has ignored all the > > > ways the web has supported, continues to support, learning w/o using > > > Flash. Flash on the web is like cooking with garlic. A little adds > > > depth, a lot is inedible. > > > > ******************************************************************* > > List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm > > Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm > > Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org > > ******************************************************************* > > ********************************************************************* > From: Simon Pascal Klein <kle...@klepas.org> > Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 16:11:57 +1100 > Subject: Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT > > On 10/01/2009, at 6:50 AM, Matt Morgan-May wrote: > > Hi, > > > > Excuse me for jumping in here, especially (in this case) as a Flash > > partisan. But I fail to see how this kind of project can be anything > > > > other > > than a good thing overall. > > > > What I don't understand is why people are instantly critical of > > projects > > that are actually attempting to increase access to new technology. > > I've > > heard a constant drumbeat of "don't use Flash: it's inaccessible" in > > > > the > > years I've been involved in the field. But if we don't have people > > pushing > > that envelope, doesn't that make that statement self-fulfilling > > prophecy? > > There are lots of us out there working on improving the > > accessibility of > > both existing and future content authored in Flash. > > > > There are many arguments to be made for HTML -- I made loads of them > > > > while > > working for W3C, all of which I would stand by today -- but it is > > not all > > things to all people. The fact is that many educators have found > > that they > > can use Flash to teach their students effectively. I'm not an > > educator by > > profession, but my wife is, and she prefers Flash over HTML/CSS/JS to > > develop her courseware. If you were to tell her she's wrong, > > especially > > before seeing what kind of work she does, I think you'd probably find > > yourself dodging a couple shelves' worth of education texts. Telling a > > professional their tools are wrong is not the most endearing of > > approaches. > > In my opinion, the best one can do is to learn what they're doing, > > and offer > > ways to make that output more efficient, more inclusive, and easier to > > produce. > > > > Teachers aren't usually web developers, and we shouldn't want them > > to be. So > > I'm all for companies taking on the technical problems so teachers > > can be > > teachers, and so on. > > Ultimately teachers should aim to teach the skills that are required > of students entering the industry. Its not uncommon that many > secondary and tertiary IT and web media courses are grossly outdated. > > From my experience this is mostly attributed to the teachers > education in the field which they received when they did their > tertiary education in order to teach, and have since not remained up > to date with new developments and sadly even standards. Money and a > requirement to regularly attend courses to keep educators up to date > help in this regard but nothing beats personal interestthe high > school IT teacher that in their own time is actively involved in his > or her field will be more likely to teach his students about the > latest relevant and exciting bleeding edge technologies. > > On a side note, my personal opinion on web media courses focusing on > rich web content is that they should still entail the bare basics of > HTML, XHTML, and CSS, with a toe-dip into JavaScript. These > technologies are so fundamental to the web, and given their role as > standards they should be part of any web-related courses. > > Just my 2¢. Thanks for raising this topic. (: > > > Pascal > > > Thanks, > > M > > Accessibility Engineer, Adobe > > > > Christie Mason said: > >> Exactly right. I've sadly watched Flash take over eLearning and > >> still > >> haven't figured out the attraction, except that it offers the > >> control of PPT > >> while appearing to be "rich". There's only a very few types of > >> web sites > >> that still use Flash for delivering primary content - media sites, > >> > >> those > >> that focus more on "look at me" instead of being a resource to > >> their site > >> guests, and eLearning. > >> > >> Since, supposedly, eLearning is about offering web based resources > >> > >> for > >> learning it just doesn't make sense to me that it has ignored all > >> the ways > >> the web has supported, continues to support, learning w/o using > >> Flash. > >> Flash on the web is like cooking with garlic. A little adds depth, > >> > >> a lot is > >> inedible. > > > > ******************************************************************* > > List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm > > Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm > > Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org > > ******************************************************************* > > --- > Simon Pascal Klein > Concept designer > > (w) http://klepas.org > (e) kle...@klepas.org > > > ************************************************************** > Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm > Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm > Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org > ************************************************************** ******************************************************************* List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org *******************************************************************
