mike...what is the difference?..merle
  
Merle,

I`m ex-armed forces. But even if I was - there`s a difference between killing 
and murder.

Mike

--- On Sat, 12/1/13, Merle Lester <[email protected]> wrote:


>From: Merle Lester <[email protected]>
>Subject: [Zen] a light heart
>To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
>Date: Saturday, 12 January, 2013, 8:06
>
>
>  
>
>
> hi mike...aren't you in the armed forces?...is there not times when one is 
>faced with the "enemy" and must kill in order to survive?
> yes a i agree with you...a life with a light heart is a beautiful 
>expression...merle
>  
>Hi Merle,
>
>
>It does look counter-intuitive, but we all have to die sometime. Better to 
>have lived well up to the point of death (no matter how premature or cruel the 
>manner in which it comes), than to go thru life knowing that you have 
>committed the act of murder. I know I want to meet my end having enjoyed life 
>with a light heart. Imagine going thru life (and your death) with all the 
>baggage that would come with having murdered someone.
>
>
>Mike
>
>--- On Tue, 8/1/13, Merle Lester <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>From: Merle Lester <[email protected]>
>>Subject: Re: [Zen] Karma is real and free will is illusion.
>>To: "[email protected]"
 <[email protected]>
>>Date: Tuesday, 8 January, 2013, 18:13
>>
>>
>>  
>>
>>
>> mike
>>
>>
>> just curious...how does that sit well with your career... better to be a 
>>victim of a murder?..merle
>>
>>
>>  
>>Suresh,
>>
>>
>>I think there`s a big difference between Buddhism and Christianity. Morality 
>>in the latter is more concerned with our actions on others than it is in 
>>Buddhism, which is much more concerned with our actions as they affect 
>>ourselves. For example, in Buddhism it is much better for us to be the victim 
>>of a murder than it is to be the murderer. The cost of being spat on pales to 
>>the cost of the person who did the spitting. 
>>
>>
>>My idea of karma/causation is in agreement with Buddha`s when he said that if 
>>you do this this will follow. If you don`t do this then that won`t follow. In 
>>other words, it all comes back down to what makes us suffer.
>>
>>
>>Mike
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>--- On Mon, 7/1/13, SURESH JAGADEESAN <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>From: SURESH JAGADEESAN <[email protected]>
>>>Subject: [Zen] Karma is real and free will is illusion.
>>>To: [email protected]
>>>Date: Monday, 7 January, 2013, 21:30
>>>
>>>
>>>Dear Joe,
>>>
>>>I agree to your argument to some extent, but still I have doubts.
>>>
>>>Joe: In the awakened state, karma and free will are moot, and do not
>>>operate. Yet, if we slide backward from the awakened state, and fall
>>>into delusion even a bit, karma (our previous conditioning,
>>>mind-habits, and the past and future results of these) will again
>>>influence us, and we will find that our behavior is not in accord with
>>>the Precepts any longer. - One must still practice in order to remain
>>>awake.
>>>
>>>Suresh: Buddha himself states that Siddhartha was died long time back
>>>and no one had noticed it. It means in the
 moment of awakening to
>>>Buddhahood, the Siddhartha died, again it means his mind is totally
>>>died and never to born. In your statement you state that the awakened
>>>one can fall back if he doesn’t practice. If one can fall back means
>>>he is not an enlightened one. A Buddha cannot fall back.
>>>
>>>Ramana Maharishi states that a guru is person who continuously abides
>>>in self, no one and no situation can change his state of being one
>>>with self.
>>>
>>>It looks like you are talking about your state; you seem deluded in
>>>your misunderstanding of Buddhahood. You are not open. You are glued
>>>to zen and feel superior over others in this forum since you have long
>>>practice of zen. This long practice itself seems hindrance to be fully
>>>awakened as Buddha. It is the problem of following something.
>>>J.Krishnamurti states that divine is pathless land.
>>>
>>>So my dear Joe, please be alert from your zen practice.
>>>
>>>Joe: But, now, free
 will is not "real", as karma is not "real".
>>>
>>>Suresh: Please note free will is not real. But’ karma’ is real. Karma
>>>is real as long as you consider yourself as body. Even if you see
>>>yourself as pure consciousness / self / Buddhahood, the body born to
>>>be you will follow karma until its destruction.
>>>
>>>Hence Buddha also not exempted from karma. And hence once in Buddha
>>>life, a person came and spitted on his face. This action to his body,
>>>he himself states that it is due to his past karma. So even a Buddha
>>>is not spared from karma. So Karma is real.
>>>
>>>Since Karma is real, there is no ‘free will’.  All our actions are
>>>influenced, if you consciously watch your actions you will know. As
>>>long as you are influenced by any force you are not a Buddha. Not even
>>>the urge of brushing your teeth.
>>>
>>>Ramana Maharishi sat motionless for nearly 1.5 years. He was shifted
>>>by people surrounded and people who were
 wondering about him. He will
>>>not even take food kept in front of him, someone had to pour some milk
>>>in his mouth by force. It was by his devotees’ effort he lived up to
>>>72 years. But himself he did not desired to continue his bodily life.
>>>
>>>Again even in Ramana’s life there were incidents of thieves attacking
>>>him, but again it is due to Karma, so even Sri.Ramana is not spared
>>>from Karma. So Karma is real and free will is illusion.
>>>
>>>Best wishes
>>>Suresh
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>-- 
>>>Thanks and best regards
>>>J.Suresh
>>>New No.3, Old No.7,
>>>Chamiers road - 1st Lane,
>>>Alwarpet,
>>>Chennai - 600018
>>>Ph: 044 42030947
>>>Mobile: 91 9884071738
>>>
>>>
>>>------------------------------------
>>>
>>>Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are 
>>>reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>
>> 
>
> 
 

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