Zendervish, The quote you asked about usually credited to Qungyaun Weixin who lived in China during the Tang Dynasty (618-907) : "Before I had studied Chan for thirty years, I saw mountains as mountains, and rivers as rivers. When I arrived at a more intimate knowledge, I came to the point where I saw that mountains are not mountains, and rivers are not rivers. But now that I have got its very substance I am at rest. For it's just that I see mountains once again as mountains, and rivers once again as rivers." â Qingyuan Weixin Here's a link to a song referring to this by Donovan you might like:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=lkLp9d7HKuA <http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=lkLp9d7HKuA> As far as time sitting... My roshi used to say that sitting well for 5 minutes was better than sitting poorly for 5 hours. ...Bill!--- In [email protected], "salik888" <novelidea8@...> wrote: > > Joe > > Agreed, the word Dharma is at best introductory, a basic perception . . . > > I don't have time to look for it, maybe someone has it at their disposal the zen story about rivers and mountains being mountains, then rivers and mountains not being mountains, and then rivers and mountains being mountains. > > As said I am headed out the door, duty calls . . . > > But most importantly, both Bill and you are urging strong practice. > > On another post someone took Bill to task, jokingly I am sure, for only practicing a certain amount of time. Some people don't need to meditate a great deal. Some, it is written, for I have not witnessed it, move quickly into samadhi. Although most do not. I certainly do not. I schlogg away at it like an Ozarkian turnip eater just off the wagon. > > I like that, strong practice . . . > > /\ > > zendervish > > --- In [email protected], "Joe" desert_woodworker@ wrote: > > > > Salik, > > > > I think in the orthodox understanding of the usage in the Soto sect you mention it, the meaning of Dharma in "Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha" is the Teaching of the Buddha, which Bill! shows as def. #3 from the dictionary contents placed online for access. > > > > Of course we can understand it as we like when we practice, it's impossible to limit it by making it narrower, and impossible to make it too broad, for practice purposes. When we awaken, it will be clear as ICE what it means. > > > > The definition is a calling card. We must call the number to reach the party we want. Or better, make our way to the address and have a visit in person. > > > > Strong practice, > > > > --Joe > > > > > "salik888" <novelidea8@> wrote: > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > Contextually, using conventional agreed upon consensus building in terms of Religion, history, cultural, etc . . . I would choose 3 when speaking of Buddhism in the big picture as taught . . . but we were not talking about this, Buddhism, Zen Buddhism, etc . . . I used it in, shall we say, a metaphysical way, the way anyone who might have a slight bent this way would understand, intrinsically . . . is the dharma everpresent? Now? > > > > > > Since we understand the word to mean (I will take out the word nature, your assessment) and use 'what is', "is" not illusion, then Buddha, Dharma, and Sangah "is". > > >
