Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
If you can not discuss the most critical digital radio issues of the time on a given group, then they will migrate to some other group, often along with other things you might have wished have remained. These issues will not just go away by themselves and to actually want to prevent discussing them before they go to the FCC, seems about the worst idea I have ever heard. Completely contrary to why you would have a discussion group which is the only source of this kind of information for most of us who are not insiders with their respective national groups (ARRL here in the U.S., etc.) Many of my current views on digital radio issues, are different than they were several years ago, precisely because of the ability to sift and winnow these issues on a larger group. I would never have even been aware of some of the issues without this group, and now some other groups that have come along since. Small groups can be OK for narrowly defined subjects, but they simply don't work for issues that affect large numbers. The foreign hams who seem to be the main ones complaining about discussion (which they don't have to even read if they choose not to), will be also will be affected by future decisions that are made in other countries. One thing I discovered as a moderator of a large worldwide discussion group (unrelated to ham radio), is that even though some complain, very few members will leave a group with too much discussion, even if they say they will. In fact, you will lose more members not having discussions that interest them. And closing down discussions, inevitably result in some of the key posters to migrate to other groups and you lose that input. The nearly 99% of a group's membership wo will rarely, if ever, provide any real input, may not realize how much effort and energy goes into posting to a group. Especially if well thought out and formatted to good readability. 73, Rick, KV9U Danny Douglas wrote: And who will go to that group? Probably only the ones being bothered with the interference! Those who are happy with WinLink, and its continuance will NOT. Why should they? If one gets what he wants, he isnt likely to go to an anti-subject group to get his daily dose of venem. The subject IS the major discussion here, and this IS about digital radio. Without the discussion, it would not be a free discussion of what digital radio is doing today, or should be doing. Frankly, those who have no interest in the subject, must not really be into digital radio, because it DOES impact each and every one of us. Danny Douglas N7DC ex WN5QMX ET2US WA5UKR ET3USA SV0WPP VS6DD N7DC/YV5 G5CTB All 2 years or more (except Novice) Pls QSL direct, buro, or LOTW preferred, I Do not use, but as a courtesy do upload to eQSL for those who do. Announce your digital presence via our Interactive Sked Page at http://www.obriensweb.com/sked DRCC contest info : http://www.obriensweb.com/drcc.htm Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
Very will put Rick, I would like to have the chorse to read the discuss and then I delete it, than to not have to right at all, we all have that right to read or not to read, with out a chorse it is over. Russell NC5O --- Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you can not discuss the most critical digital radio issues of the time on a given group, then they will migrate to some other group, often along with other things you might have wished have remained. These issues will not just go away by themselves and to actually want to prevent discussing them before they go to the FCC, seems about the worst idea I have ever heard. Completely contrary to why you would have a discussion group which is the only source of this kind of information for most of us who are not insiders with their respective national groups (ARRL here in the U.S., etc.) Many of my current views on digital radio issues, are different than they were several years ago, precisely because of the ability to sift and winnow these issues on a larger group. I would never have even been aware of some of the issues without this group, and now some other groups that have come along since. Small groups can be OK for narrowly defined subjects, but they simply don't work for issues that affect large numbers. The foreign hams who seem to be the main ones complaining about discussion (which they don't have to even read if they choose not to), will be also will be affected by future decisions that are made in other countries. One thing I discovered as a moderator of a large worldwide discussion group (unrelated to ham radio), is that even though some complain, very few members will leave a group with too much discussion, even if they say they will. In fact, you will lose more members not having discussions that interest them. And closing down discussions, inevitably result in some of the key posters to migrate to other groups and you lose that input. The nearly 99% of a group's membership wo will rarely, if ever, provide any real input, may not realize how much effort and energy goes into posting to a group. Especially if well thought out and formatted to good readability. 73, Rick, KV9U Danny Douglas wrote: And who will go to that group? Probably only the ones being bothered with the interference! Those who are happy with WinLink, and its continuance will NOT. Why should they? If one gets what he wants, he isnt likely to go to an anti-subject group to get his daily dose of venem. The subject IS the major discussion here, and this IS about digital radio. Without the discussion, it would not be a free discussion of what digital radio is doing today, or should be doing. Frankly, those who have no interest in the subject, must not really be into digital radio, because it DOES impact each and every one of us. Danny Douglas N7DC ex WN5QMX ET2US WA5UKR ET3USA SV0WPP VS6DD N7DC/YV5 G5CTB All 2 years or more (except Novice) Pls QSL direct, buro, or LOTW preferred, I Do not use, but as a courtesy do upload to eQSL for those who do. Announce your digital presence via our Interactive Sked Page at http://www.obriensweb.com/sked DRCC contest info : http://www.obriensweb.com/drcc.htm Yahoo! Groups Links = IN GOD WE TRUST ! = Russell Blair NC5O Skype-Russell Blair Hell Field #300 DRCC #55 Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
I believe you're right! It was set up to be a VENT group. Don't think it ever really accomplished anything nor did it really get off the ground! Rod Chris Jewell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rodney writes: Just did a Group search and it's there. It's called, FCCSUCKS, but there's only ONE message on it and who knows if it even has a moderator!. I agree, someone (NOT me) needs to start an FCC Rules discussion group! Rod KC7CJO It appears that the digipol Y!-group was set up for exactly this purpose, but there seem to be no members or messages. I have a vague recollection that our moderator may have established that group so he'd have someplace to which to banish the endless flamewars about the FCC subbands-by-bandwidth NPRM, WL2K sucks|rocks, automatic busy detection for bots should is mandatory|is infeasible, etc, but I'm not sure I'm not confabulating here. :-) 73 DE KW6H (ex-AE6VW) -- Chris Jewell [EMAIL PROTECTED] PO Box 1396 Gualala CA USA 95445 - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
Demetre SV1UY wrote: Hi all, Following this discussion I could help but notice the frontpage of this group. It mentions DIGITALRADIO GROUP International. -- DIGITALRADIO GROUP A meeting place for discussion of amateur radio digital modes, applications, software, hardware, equipment, and on the air activity. DigitalRadio is for ALL digital modes... JT65A PSK MFSK OLIVIA PAX CHIP64 THROB ALE DIGI SSTV DIGI VOICE RTTY PACKET DOMINOEX HELL THROB ALE PACTOR OFDM ARQ SS DATA AND MORE : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : 1 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 1 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 Digital QSOs and experimental modes are encouraged on the DIGITALRADIO GROUP international ham radio center-of-activity frequencies: -- Really what the FCC will decide concerns the american hams not the rest of the world. If this group is only for americans then fair enough. 73 de Demetre SV1UY Thanks for that Demetre I would, as a compromise, suggest that the Professional debaters go away to another group for their discussions, and after reaching a consensus ( if that is possible) then come back to this group and let us know what that consensus is. Kevin VK5OA
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
Obviously some folks have not learned how to skip over threads that do not interest them. Others I'm sure don't want to hear what they're doing may be incorrect. Sad. I hope it survives and does well but it of no interest to me. The way this is handled on QRP-L mailing list is simply to preface an off-topic post with OT: and those who do not want to be bothered with off-topic posts can simply filter them out, or use the Delete key. Doesn't work with digests, but those can be scanned visually and OT: skipped over. 73, Skip KH6TY
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
Danny Douglas wrote: And who will go to that group? Probably only the ones being bothered with the interference! Those who are happy with WinLink, and its continuance will NOT. Why should they? If one gets what he wants, he isnt likely to go to an anti-subject group to get his daily dose of venem. The subject IS the major discussion here, and this IS about digital radio. Without the discussion, it would not be a free discussion of what digital radio is doing today, or should be doing. Frankly, those who have no interest in the subject, must not really be into digital radio, because it DOES impact each and every one of us. Danny Douglas N7DC It appears as though those of us who do not favor, and do not appreciate, the practice of Winlink stations to transmit QRM indiscriminately are being told to either shut up or leave. I might point out that most of the discussions about Pactor originate when one of the Pactor advocates posts something to the effect that the rest of us must make way for robot Pactor stations whenever necessary, Pactor robot operations are more important than what the rest of us are doing, Pactor Winlink stations own certain frequencies, etc. de Roger W6VZV
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
There used to be a group called, FCC Sucks!, or something like that, but I haven't heard anything from it in a long time. Howard Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, we need to have a place where the discussions of FCC rules are appropriate. Does anyone know of such a group on Yahoo?? Andy, would you consider creating such a group?? Howard K5HB --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, dl8le [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Per definition the DIGITALRADIO GROUP is A meeting place for discussion of amateur radio digital modes, applications, software, hardware, equipment, and on the air activity. The ongoing discussion about legal or formal topics since a couple of weeks with constant repeating of all the old arguments without any new ideas or aspects is more than boring and for sure not in line with the original definition. It's just repeating something and no interest in carefully considering the other party's arguments. And, worst of all, only one part of the different subjects of this group, the air activity if this term can be applied at all, is discussed over and over again with absolutely no progress. Please count the posts on FCC regulations, fundamental (and unfortunately non-technical) contributions to emergency communication in particular the spending of 250 KUSD for radio equipment etc (I don't want to waste my time to list all what I have read in the past weeks since I joined this group), and then compare that number to the posts on real topics of this group. The ratio between the two figures is in my opinion completely inadequate. I like open discussions but there should be an end sometime, at least that the different parties come to the conclusion that there will be no agreement. That is at least an agreement. If the present discussions will continue I will for sure leave this group. The group will survive it, of course, but I wonder if not many others not commenting in public will look for a better alternative to the meeting place the Digitalradio Group is offering at the moment. 73 Juergen, DL8LE - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
Just did a Group search and it's there. It's called, FCCSUCKS, but there's only ONE message on it and who knows if it even has a moderator!. I agree, someone (NOT me) needs to start an FCC Rules discussion group! Rod KC7CJO Howard Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, we need to have a place where the discussions of FCC rules are appropriate. Does anyone know of such a group on Yahoo?? Andy, would you consider creating such a group?? Howard K5HB --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, dl8le [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Per definition the DIGITALRADIO GROUP is A meeting place for discussion of amateur radio digital modes, applications, software, hardware, equipment, and on the air activity. The ongoing discussion about legal or formal topics since a couple of weeks with constant repeating of all the old arguments without any new ideas or aspects is more than boring and for sure not in line with the original definition. It's just repeating something and no interest in carefully considering the other party's arguments. And, worst of all, only one part of the different subjects of this group, the air activity if this term can be applied at all, is discussed over and over again with absolutely no progress. Please count the posts on FCC regulations, fundamental (and unfortunately non-technical) contributions to emergency communication in particular the spending of 250 KUSD for radio equipment etc (I don't want to waste my time to list all what I have read in the past weeks since I joined this group), and then compare that number to the posts on real topics of this group. The ratio between the two figures is in my opinion completely inadequate. I like open discussions but there should be an end sometime, at least that the different parties come to the conclusion that there will be no agreement. That is at least an agreement. If the present discussions will continue I will for sure leave this group. The group will survive it, of course, but I wonder if not many others not commenting in public will look for a better alternative to the meeting place the Digitalradio Group is offering at the moment. 73 Juergen, DL8LE - Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
Rodney writes: Just did a Group search and it's there. It's called, FCCSUCKS, but there's only ONE message on it and who knows if it even has a moderator!. I agree, someone (NOT me) needs to start an FCC Rules discussion group! Rod KC7CJO It appears that the digipol Y!-group was set up for exactly this purpose, but there seem to be no members or messages. I have a vague recollection that our moderator may have established that group so he'd have someplace to which to banish the endless flamewars about the FCC subbands-by-bandwidth NPRM, WL2K sucks|rocks, automatic busy detection for bots should is mandatory|is infeasible, etc, but I'm not sure I'm not confabulating here. :-) 73 DE KW6H (ex-AE6VW) -- Chris Jewell [EMAIL PROTECTED] PO Box 1396 Gualala CA USA 95445
Re: [digitalradio] Re: Digitalradio Group
Juergen is correct. I will end this thread at 1200 Z, 16/01/08 Digipol can be be used to continue the thresd. On Jan 15, 2008 9:16 PM, jgorman01 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know some of the comments and arguments here are boring at times. However, they do serve a purpose in refining positions and educating folks about the rules. Let's face it, with the number of hams the US has we are an 800 pound gorilla in amateur radio. Maybe not the only one, but certainly right in with a very few. If wide data modes used with auto stations and beacons everywhere proliferate in the US you folks in Europe will be greatly affected in about three years. I don't know how long you've been a ham, but you may not have been around for the last good ones in the 60's and 80's. The interference issues we are talking about here in the US right now will bother you as much or even more come what, about 2011, when the bands are open all day long to pretty much everywhere. You should be interested in what the outcome of all this will be. Jim WA0LYK --- In digitalradio@yahoogroups.com, dl8le [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Per definition the DIGITALRADIO GROUP is A meeting place for discussion of amateur radio digital modes, applications, software, hardware, equipment, and on the air activity. The ongoing discussion about legal or formal topics since a couple of weeks with constant repeating of all the old arguments without any new ideas or aspects is more than boring and for sure not in line with the original definition. It's just repeating something and no interest in carefully considering the other party's arguments. And, worst of all, only one part of the different subjects of this group, the air activity if this term can be applied at all, is discussed over and over again with absolutely no progress. Please count the posts on FCC regulations, fundamental (and unfortunately non-technical) contributions to emergency communication in particular the spending of 250 KUSD for radio equipment etc (I don't want to waste my time to list all what I have read in the past weeks since I joined this group), and then compare that number to the posts on real topics of this group. The ratio between the two figures is in my opinion completely inadequate. I like open discussions but there should be an end sometime, at least that the different parties come to the conclusion that there will be no agreement. That is at least an agreement. If the present discussions will continue I will for sure leave this group. The group will survive it, of course, but I wonder if not many others not commenting in public will look for a better alternative to the meeting place the Digitalradio Group is offering at the moment. 73 Juergen, DL8LE -- Andy K3UK www.obriensweb.com (QSL via N2RJ)
