Rick,
On 3/28/24 15:38, Rick Noel wrote:
my bottleneck (app slowness to respond is the at the database
connection max), I am not even going to try and adjust minThreads and
maxThreads. When I tried to increase maxConnection to our database
from and existing connection max of 20, to a new connectionMax of 50,
I got errors, see attached snapshot.
This list strips most attachments including images. Please post text.
I was able to raise the maxConnection to database up to 30 with no
errors, so I am just going to deploy at that level until we upgrade our
Postgess database
We are using a really old Postgres and plan in the near to future to
upgrade that database.
It's not the software version that matters, it's the (possibly virtual)
hardware.
BTW,
I did find and use the Apache Benchmark tool and was able to see how
our app responses with a test requests of 10000 and concurrent
requests of 40 and those results look good to me with worst response
time of only 1000 miliseconds.
That's great for 40 simultaneous requests, but what happens when you
crank it up to 300? Or 500? Or whatever?
You may want to use JMeter which is a better load-testing tool than 'ab'
once you get beyond just throwing X requests at a site.
-chris
-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2024 3:09 PM
To: users@tomcat.apache.org
Subject: [EXT]Re: [EXT]Re: performance tunning of Tomcat 10
Rick,
On 3/27/24 09:22, Rick Noel wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>
Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2024 8:24 AM
To: Tomcat Users List <users@tomcat.apache.org>; Rick Noel
<rn...@westwoodone.com.INVALID>
Cc: Voodoo nmulcahy gmail <nmulc...@gmail.com>; David Jung
<david.j...@cumulus.com>
Subject: [EXT]Re: performance tunning of Tomcat 10
Rick,
On 3/27/24 07:53, Rick Noel wrote:
I was wondering if the apache foundation has any tools we can use to
fine tune Tomcat 10. Tools to deteming how to set the best heap size
for Tomcat startup and the best connection attributes of
minSpareThreads and MaxThreads.
What is your goal?
Our application is a sip phone call handling application.(A voice
response xml application) The goal is to not have call bottleneck at peak call
volume.
Sometimes too many folks call at one time hit our app and calls are not handle
correctly.
I know my application at times will reach 100 concurrent connections
> and some times goes has high as 500 connections.
Okay.
Well I do not have actual traffic info down to the sec, But from the
application logs I know that that points in the day more than 300
calls can come in
Okay, you need to get better information. Check out this presentation on Tomcat
monitoring:
https://tomcat.apache.org/presentations.html#latest-monitoring-with-jmx
There is a lot in there, but I do talk about checking on the request processor
to see how many requests are in-flight at once. You can do the same with your
database pool.
You'll want to grab samples of those things at regular intervals to see how
they correlate. I suspect you know when your peak times are, so schedule the
samples to be taken during that timeframe. You could even sample once per
second if you wanted to -- the calls are pretty inexpensive.
Should I boost minSpareThreads and maxThread values of what I plan to
use below? > Or why would we not just set very high minSpareThreads
and maxThread values like minSpareThreads =300 and maxThread=1000
This is a snippet of my server.xml
<Executor name="tomcatPhoneAppThreadPool" namePrefix="catalina-executor-"
minSpareThreads="50"
maxThreads="300" />
<Connector port="8585"
executor="tomcatPhoneAppThreadPool"
compression="on"
compressionMinSize="2048"
compressableMimeType="text/html,text/xml,text/plain,text/css,text/javascript,application/javascript,application/json,application/xml"
protocol="org.apache.coyote.http11.Http11NioProtocol"
redirectPort="8443">
<UpgradeProtocol
className="org.apache.coyote.http2.Http2Protocol" />
</Connector>
Also, am I good with setting
protocol="org.apache.coyote.http11.Http11NioProtocol"
And then setting <UpgradeProtocol
className="org.apache.coyote.http2.Http2Protocol" />
That will tell Tomcat to do HTTP2 Correct?
That's the only way to enable h2. Well... you could use Http11Nio2Protocol,
too. NIO is the default protocol so you don't even need to add that
specifically if you don't want to.
Back to threads.
Each thread (unless you go virtual, but that's not really production-ready IMHO at this
point unless you have very strict circumstances where it will work great for you) takes
up a bunch of memory, so you can't just set maxThreads=1M. Threads take "time"
to start, but it's not really that much. If starting and stopping threads is what is
making your application slow, than you have a very high-performance application and
environment indeed.
Your question as stated is unanswerable.
You say you are sometimes hitting 500 connections. The default maximum number of
connections is 10000 and you are only using 500. That means you aren't being flooded,
which is a Good Thing. (BTW: How are you measuring "how many connections" you
have? Make sure you are measuring the right thing...
I am estimating the actual connections just based on application call logs.
Is your *current* maxThreads set to 500? If so, then your thread pool maximum
is set to your high-water mark which seems like it should be fine. If you set
your maxThreads to 1000 you won't get any benefit because only 500 requests are
ever being sent at once, right?
What else does your application do?
Our application is a sip phone call handling application.(A voice
response xml application)
For example, if you have a thread-pool max-threads of 1000 and your application
uses an RDBMS for every request but your db connection pool size is more like
10, then many threads waiting on a small number of connections gets you
absolutely no benefit. You'd have to make changes elsewhere in your application
in order to make use of those extra threads.
Similarly, if you have a big thread pool and a big db connection pool, but your
database performs slowly, then having all that power on the application server
doesn't really help you.
Yes our app is using a database (we use Postres) And yes I assume
that is our bottleneck Our tomcat context.xml defines that database
maxConnction to be only maxTotal="20"
So if you are allowing up to 300 or 500 threads and most of them need a
database connection, then you are really limiting yourself to more like
20 simultaneous requests served.
You will likely need to increase that db connection pool size.
We have other apps and that hit this same database, so we define low
maxTotal on each server so each server can have only limit
connection access to the database
Well...
I am thinkingit would be best to try and NOT optimize minSpareThreads
and maxThreads but instead to determine what is the optimal Database
connection maxTotal to set
I agree. And if your database can't handle it, then you need to invest more $$$
in your database, or re-think how to store data.
One way to re-think things is to consider replication/clustering of your
existing database. I'm not super familiar with PostgreSQL but I suspect you can
use multi-primary deployments and read-only replicas as long as your
application understands how to interact properly with that kind of deployment.
Another option would be to use a different kind of database like Cassandra or
whatever which is optimized for writes (if you are write-heavy). You might also
be able to segment your data differently, so information about current
in-progress calls goes to a high-performance but small database (possibly
in-memory) and longer-term storage can be used for things that need to out-last
the phone call such as statistics and stuff like that.
So anyone trying to answer "how big should be thread pool be" really needs to
understand the nature of your application and the other things happening in your
environment.
Sometimes the answer is "just add more threads/CPUs/memory" and sometimes the answer is
"re-think your application architecture".
-chris
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