on 2/21/03 4:53 AM, Ploegmakers, Joost at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> >> Not only can you make a distinction in the melody but the >> type of sounds being used. > > > Disagree; trance borrows a lot of it's sounds from techno.
I understand what your trying to say but trance uses chessier fluf type sounds. >> I disagree early Detroit techno sounds like a fusion of >> Kraftwerk/ Euro dance with Chicago >> house. > > Could you name some examples? The Chicago house influence is in ALL if the old Detroit techno records. As far as Euro Dance listen to No UFO's (Juan Atkins tries to sound new wave), Nude Photo (Yazoo sample), and Techno Music. > Of course I know Juan, Derrick and all were > definately influenced by Kraftwerk, but I don't hear that so directly in > their production. > Ok maybe their sounds were used a lot, but definately not > their way of composing. All of Juan Atkins pre-techno stuff sounds like Kraftwerk, the spoken word vox, the way he programs beats and synthesizers. Channel One - Technicolor for example. >> It wasn't revolutionary to Western music. >> It's music that came from the drum machine era, the drum >> machine and sequencer more or less influenced the techno sound. > > > Disagree again, a lot of music was already using drum machines and > sequencers for years. hi-nrg, new wave, italo, house. But all that music > still consisted of songs. You know, chorus, refrain, chorus. Acid house and > later techno were the first to break from that tradition. Don't be absurd, classical electronic artist like Mortan Subotnik were the first to break this tradition. I agree, The old Chicago/ Detroit sound was revolutionary but I wouldn't call it anti western they were essentially drum machine rhythm tracks. 1, 5, 9, 13 on a TR-808 16 step sequence, put the closed hi-hat on 1-16. Was Derrick May an avant guarde music composer who sat back in his chair conceptualizing an ant-western composition style of music then going to Juan Atkins TR-808 to program the beats? No, he was influenced by Juan Atkins and Chicago house, the mechanical nature of those drum machines pretty much influenced techno, it was only natural they had a futuristic approach with electronic sounding gear which like electro sounded mechanical in nature. >> Trance and progressive is basically an update to the 80's >> Euro dance/ Hi-NRG music although >> you do hear the influence of techno and house with the use of >> the TR-909. Take the vocals out of Erasure, the music Vince >> Clarke pioneered and you hear the similarities. > > I think you're confusing trance with electroclash here. Well yeah I mean electroclash tries to sound like the Eurythmics but listen to the apeggio style on old HINRG records by Patrick Crawly and people like Vince Clarke who have been doing that style for over 30 years. Of course trance has house and techno sensibilities but in my opinion the roots are essentially gay club HINRG music. > Or the techno records that are being released are simply not that > revolutionary anymore so they start looking for other stuff that can trigger > their needs. And they realise that because they were almost exclusively > listening to techno over all those years, they neglected some great other > types of music. So they simply want to catch up. > In my case it doesn't have anything to do with the nostalgia trend. > Regarding electro and house it's much more about (re)discovery. I still > listen to a lot of hard techno. I just hardly buy anything form detroit > anymore. German producers like Ricardo Villalobos, Heiko Laux or Alter ego > are much more groundbreaking nowadays. To me it all comes down to a formula that works, if you want to promote broken beat as the new techno sound that's great but if it's irritating undanceable music that you cant groove to it's worthless. My constructive opinion advice is since there are a lot of good ideas in old Detroit techno set up a label dedicated to the sound. I would be running to the record store to buy an old gated reverb 808 track like My Medusa or better version of Techno Music, there a lot of great ideas in old techno all you have to do is refine the production style, when I listen to that old music I think to myself certain aspects of the production and composition could be better. Strings Of Life is a perfect 10 track, but there are other track by Derrick May that could be better.
