Old thread but finally found the answer to what was going on with this link - and it’s stupid.
The 820C has 3 part numbers to cover the 11Ghz band. Apparently the coordinated frequency was outside of the range of the radio part number we were using. Amateur mistake. A couple of contributing factors - but one of the bigger ones is that the 820C will happily accept a frequency assignment outside of the sub-band without complaint. The older 800’s and other brands we have used puke if you try to do that. We have kept all of our links in one sub-band for sparing. I think there is a newer 820C high power that has external swappable duplexers that will simplify the sparing but stocking one pair of radios and just the duplexers. I need to have our NOC look into that since we now have a ’spares’ problem. Mark > On Mar 6, 2020, at 2:49 PM, Mark Radabaugh <m...@amplex.net> wrote: > > I think at this point we are just going to go back out and try it without the > Dragonwave adapter by swapping the mounting plate on the back of the antennas > to the Cambium plates. We have a set of mounting plates on hand. > > Mark > >> On Mar 6, 2020, at 2:46 PM, Caleb Knauer <cknauer.li...@gmail.com >> <mailto:cknauer.li...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> He swapped radio pairs with known good in the field and that wasn't it. And >> you can't rotate ODU flanges on C, they're fixed and meant to go to some >> mediation devices. You can on the single core S. >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 2:43 PM <ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> >> wrote: >> If somehow those rectangular sections are not aligned you could have that >> problem. >> I am leaning toward a bad radio. >> You could put both radios on the bench. Divert one of the rectangular >> waveguides on each end. >> I would not block it but just put some kind of 45 degree reflector in front >> of it to direct the signal somewhere else. >> Or if you could find some absorbing foam to put in front of it. >> >> From: Roland Houin <> >> Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 12:35 PM >> To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' <> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question >> >> I believe that you can rotate the waveguides in the odu. >> >> That could result in an incorrect polarization.. >> >> I believe we have run into that in the past >> >> >> >> Roland >> >> >> >> From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On >> Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> >> Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 2:32 PM >> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com >> <mailto:af@af.afmug.com>> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question >> >> >> >> Acorns in the radome. >> >> >> >> From: Mark Radabaugh >> >> Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 12:18 PM >> >> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group >> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question >> >> >> >> Not a lot of options to put these together wrong. Line up the hangers and >> it’s good to go: >> >> >> >> <image001.jpg><image002.jpg> >> >> >> >> Mark Radabaugh >> >> Amplex >> >> 22690 Pemberville Rd >> >> Luckey, OH 43443 >> >> 419-261-5996 >> >> >> >> >> On Mar 6, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Steve Jones <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com <>> wrote: >> >> >> >> whats the OMT look like? That V/H pin puts the plate at 45? >> >> >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 12:48 PM Caleb Knauer <cknauer.li...@gmail.com <>> >> wrote: >> >> If that center part is press fit in slightly catawampus and not 100% >> plumb then it could cause issues. Or the pipe isn't 100% either. But >> kind of grasping at straws with that. >> >> On the C's I've bench tested with XPIC without antennas, it'll talk to >> either one IIRC if you run 2/1 or 1/2 as I've played with it. It's >> really not happy about it though. I'd have to confirm though, been a >> bit. >> >> XPIC keys or settings wouldn't affect the raw RXL levels, it just >> blows out your MSE if they're crossed. I've seen links where they >> didn't turn on anything XPIC but set it up and it works, just kinda >> janky. >> >> You could always mute one core on both sides and sanity check that way >> too. If something is crossed, it'd show the right RXL one on core and >> 30ish dBm down on the other core. >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 1:12 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com <>> wrote: >> > >> > You look at Mark's photo and think what could possibly be wrong, it's a >> > round hole. How many ways are there to install a round hole, it's like >> > the proverbial one car funeral procession. >> > >> > And I guess with an 820C + OMT, having H and V swapped shouldn't be >> > possible, and even if they were, it would still work if you did the same >> > thing at both ends. I wouldn't assume though that XPIC would straighten >> > out an H/V swap, I don't think it's like MIMO on WiFi. XPIC assumes the >> > antenna cross pol rejection does most of the work and it has to clean up >> > what remains. >> > >> > I'm assuming you have the XPIC keys enabled, although that would probably >> > create an alarm not the symptoms you are seeing. >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com <>> On Behalf Of Caleb Knauer >> > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 11:40 AM >> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com <>> >> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question >> > >> > With XPIC it wouldn't matter that slot 1 was talking to slot 2 on the >> > other side, it wouldn't know. At least I think anyways. Since it's just >> > looking for RX on the frequency it's set, and it's on the same on both >> > ends, and it'd still have XPD to separate the two. You could rotate one >> > end 90 degrees to simulate on the office rig to test I suppose. Plus >> > anyways if you can't get signal worth a flip on the office rig, even if it >> > was a polarity thing, that short of a link should blast it through to >> > something you'd see. >> > >> > Only thing I can think of is that something in that tube is not aligned, >> > bad press fit or mill or something like that and the waves are getting >> > blown out of phase or similar. There's not but one way to put it >> > together, and 820c -> OMT takes it to circular and you have circular to >> > dish. >> > >> > On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 12:30 PM Mark Radabaugh <m...@amplex.net <>> wrote: >> > > >> > > Odd thing is I don’t see any way to assemble this any way that would >> > > swap polarity. Only way to screw it up would be internal to the OMT >> > > itself. We are doing XPIC with this link which we have not done in a >> > > lot of other places, so that is different. >> > > >> > > Mark >> > > >> > > On Mar 6, 2020, at 12:22 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com <> wrote: >> > > >> > > >> > > V&H being swapped will always cost you at least 20 dB and if you have >> > > them precisely aligned V&H I can see where 40 dB is reasonable. >> > > >> > > From: Ken Hohhof >> > > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 10:18 AM >> > > To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' >> > > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question >> > > >> > > >> > > OK, that says the antenna should be dual pol capable. So … is a >> > > puzzlement. You’d expect a problem would cost a few dB, not 40 dB. >> > > Unless H & V were swapped. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Sounds like Cambium is looking into it, maybe they come up with some >> > > ideas. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com <>> On Behalf Of Mark Radabaugh >> > > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 11:00 AM >> > > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com <>> >> > > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > It’s currently 2 single pol Horizons on a Dragonwave OMT mount that >> > > combines the H&V to the round waveguide on the back of the antenna. >> > > >> > > Mark Radabaugh >> > > >> > > Amplex >> > > >> > > 22690 Pemberville Rd >> > > >> > > Luckey, OH 43443 >> > > >> > > 419-261-5996 >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > On Mar 6, 2020, at 11:19 AM, Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com <>> wrote: >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > We put 11 GHz 820C w/XPIC on existing Trango 3 ft dishes replacing >> > > single pol ApexPlus ODUs and everything went as expected. I’d have to >> > > look up the details but I think it worked because Trango used Remec >> > > circular even with single pol except for 6 GHz. We should have adjusted >> > > for best XPIC cancellation but instead we just made sure the ODUs were >> > > plumb. But I think what we did was roughly the same as what you’re >> > > doing, so it should work. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > We got a couple bad 820S radios last year, failed the RF loopback test, >> > > but it sounds like you have pretty thoroughly verified it’s not bad >> > > radios. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Were the Dragonwaves single or dual pol? >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com <>> On Behalf Of Mark Radabaugh >> > > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 9:37 AM >> > > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com <>> >> > > Subject: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > We have installed a lot of Cambium 820C radios without much trouble. >> > > Yes, the configuration takes some getting used to but we probably have >> > > 46 links working and installed, so it’s not like it’s our first rodeo >> > > configuring these things. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > And then we tried something new - reusing a 4’ Andrew Dragonwave >> > > antenna in a XPIC configuration. We purchased the Cambium adapter >> > > plate that clips onto the antenna radio mount and presents the 820C >> > > mount for the OMT. Take off the dual Horizon radio OMT, add the 820C >> > > and the RF signal is shit - in the -80’s from the mid 40’s. Reverse >> > > the process and put the Horizon’s back on and the signal is fine. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > So we thought we had a bad 820C. It’s happened before. So we take two >> > > different sets of 820C’s and test them one at a time swapping them in >> > > for known good installed radios on working links. The 820C’s are fine. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Okay… we forgot to test the OMT's when we did that. So we try the >> > > OMT’s in the shop - and they work fine. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > At this point the only thing left is the antennas themselves and the >> > > adapter plate. The adapter plate is nothing more than a hole in a >> > > aluminum bushing with a couple of small steps to match diameter between >> > > the OMT and the antenna waveguide. Pretty hard to screw up. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > We have a pair of Dragonwave antenna’s in the shop that we can mount all >> > > of this to and try here - and we can’t get a decent signal even 20’ >> > > apart. I’m at a loss at this point. The only part that doesn’t >> > > appear to work is the adapter plate - and there is nothing interesting >> > > about it. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > How the heck can this not work: >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > <image001.jpg> >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > <image002.jpg> >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > I can’t buy that the alignment of the antenna would need to be adjusted. >> > > That makes no sense in my head. Am I wrong in that assumption? >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Mark >> > > >> > > -- >> > > AF mailing list >> > > AF@af.afmug.com <> >> > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > > <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> > > >> > > ________________________________ >> > > -- >> > > AF mailing list >> > > AF@af.afmug.com <> >> > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > > <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> > > -- >> > > AF mailing list >> > > AF@af.afmug.com <> >> > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > > <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> > > >> > > -- >> > > AF mailing list >> > > AF@af.afmug.com <> >> > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > > <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> > >> > -- >> > AF mailing list >> > AF@af.afmug.com <> >> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > AF mailing list >> > AF@af.afmug.com <> >> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com <> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com <> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com <> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
