Information is negentropy, so increase of entropy implies decrease of information...
Acquiring information about a system is associated with entropy production... On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Aaron Nitzkin <[email protected]> wrote: > Sorry, I must be a little confused -- probably thinking from the wrong > perspective . . . I would think that there is more information > in the future about the past than vice versa, because we know more about the > past than we do about the future, and also, doesn't > increase in entropy imply increase in information (because it requries more > information to specify the configuration of a system > with higher entropy than the same system with lower entropy?) > > On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 8:27 AM, Ben Goertzel <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> In the early part of the paper, the author clarifies that while he >> assumes "temporal precedence as an aspect of causality" for >> simplicity, actually his approach would work with any other systematic >> way of assigning asymmetric directions to relationships between events >> >> I have been thinking a lot about how to infer causality from >> non-time-series data (e.g. categorial gene expression data), and this >> is a case where looking at some other sort of asymmetry than temporal >> precedence (but that may generally correlated with temporal >> precedence) seems to make sense. E.g. I've been thinking about >> looking at informational asymmetry: If one has P(A = a | B=b), one can >> look at whether the distribution for A gives more information about >> the distribution for B, or vice versa. This informational asymmetry >> can be used similarly to temporal asymmetry in defining causality. >> Furthermore, it on the average is going to correlate with temporal >> asymmetry, because the past tends to contain more information about >> the future than vice versa (due to entropy increase, roughly >> speaking... but there's more story here...) >> >> -- Ben >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 5:34 AM, Michael van der Gulik >> <[email protected]> wrote: >> > "Chapter 1. Quantum mechanics... " >> > >> > It's a nice article; I'll add it to my reading list. Prediction involves >> > working out what causes what, so it's pretty fundamental. >> > >> > I have a question. Causation in my mind seems to always involve time, >> > and I >> > suspect it's impossible to have causation without including timing. >> > So... >> > >> > Is it possible for a cause to happen at exactly the same moment as its >> > effect? >> > >> > Is it possible for a cause to happen after its effect? >> > >> > One instance I'm trying to get my head around is when an intelligence >> > anticipates a cause (which is an event in the future), which results in >> > the >> > intelligence acting such that the effect occurs before the cause. >> > Perhaps >> > the anticipation itself is the causal event. >> > >> > Regards, >> > Michael. >> > >> > >> > On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 7:17 AM, Ben Goertzel <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> I just happened across this 2011 paper on the probabilistic foundation >> >> of causality, >> >> >> >> http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/9729/1/Website_Version_2.pdf >> >> >> >> which seems to carefully clarify a bunch of issues that remain >> >> dangling in prior discussions of the topic >> >> >> >> It seems to give a good characterization of what it means for "P to >> >> appear to cause Q, based on the knowledge-base of observer O" >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Ben Goertzel, PhD >> >> http://goertzel.org >> >> >> >> "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one >> >> persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all >> >> progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw >> >> >> >> -- >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> >> Groups >> >> "Artificial General Intelligence" group. >> >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >> >> an >> >> email to [email protected]. >> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > http://gulik.pbwiki.com/ >> > >> > -- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > Groups >> > "Artificial General Intelligence" group. >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >> > an >> > email to [email protected]. >> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> >> >> >> -- >> Ben Goertzel, PhD >> http://goertzel.org >> >> "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one >> persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all >> progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "opencog" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/opencog. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > -- Ben Goertzel, PhD http://goertzel.org "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw ------------------------------------------- AGI Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/21088071-f452e424 Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=21088071&id_secret=21088071-58d57657 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
