C'da,
>I think I have forced you off the road completely. You are making wild
assertions now.
Hehe! But sometimes some of these assertions do stick :)
>I won't question your hearing, but just consider this: If the rumor has
any substance, what does it do to the image of that vicious Central
watch-dog CAG ?
This has more to with local contracts (PWD, ASEB, Flood Control , etc) than
with the likes of CAG. All state govt. entities and managed, controlled and
work order distributed to to 'locals'.
>*** Can we now, with what we unearthed with these debates, agree that
Sandip Dutta's >charge that " ONLY --- a few Axomiya officers and
politicians have become rich at the >expense of these villagers" is at least
BASELESS, if not entirely malicious, designed to >paint Oxomiya
disaffections as THEIR own damn fault?
C'da - this is a round-robin. No, we can't agree with your assessment.
Are you now saying that NO Axomiya officers/politicians have not shared in
the loot?
Without the active connivence of Assamese Officers/politicians
Assam would have been in a much better shape.
# These big Indian beneficiaries indulge in corrupt practices > ONLY
because Assam govt. officials do;
Are we playing chicken and egg stuff here? You would like to portray
Assamese officers/politicians as pure as the driven snow - and if perchance
they are found to be corrupt, it is the fault of the Delhiwallas or some
other alien.
All I said was - big businesses will try every trick to capture a contract
or two. (It happens here too). Now, the ball is really in the court of
officials and politicians in Assam to protect what is Assamese and protect
Assamese interests and NOT succumb to wiles of the Delhi wallas? If they do?
what does that make Assamese look like.
Further, these same companies also operate in the same fashion in other
states. (I know you don't like to hear this).How is it that these other
states are able to make sure that the people of the state can look forward
to some residuals?
>that by NOT RISING AGAINST and abetting Assam Govt. corruption by default,
the >entire Oxomiya 'jaati' is also guilty of incubating and spreading its
own disaffections. >That it is their own damn fault, even though YOU could
not, or would not TELL us >WHAT they could do to change things under the
prevailing system
A number of have stated in these columns, that corrupt govt. or officers can
be dealt with a coordinated effort by the media, RTI, people etc. Now, the
results may not be immediate as one would wish, but a constant and frequent
exposure of corrupt officials and politicians would hit home ultimately.
What most of us take issue is that all the states deal with the same GOI and
same sets of rules or impediments, then why is that Assam happens to be in
far worse shape than most other states (including the NE states).
# That Assam is unique in its depravity -- that the corruption of the
people of Assam is >almost complete, and thus they have forfeited the right
to complain about Indians >stealing them blind.
I think the common folks in Assam are just like the common folks elsewhere.
In Assam, many politicians/businesses and bureaucrats have found a unique
path to this gravvy train.
So, it will be up to middle class intelligentisia and student orgs. to take
up this battle against corruption and put Assam on a positive path.
BTW: You can still complain about "Indian" stealing them blind. Fortunately,
there are many Assamese who do think they are Indians. :)
--Ram
On 11/25/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Ram:
I think I have forced you off the road completely. You are making wild
assertions now.
>I have heard, in many projects, 0/100.
>That is absolutely nothing gets done (everything is done in the paperwork
>though)
I won't question your hearing, but just consider this: If the rumor has
any substance, what does it do to the image of that vicious Central
watch-dog CAG ?
BK will be very disappointed.
I would refrain from taking all the other assertions apart. And I fess up
to my culpability here for taking you there. My bad :-)!
Now then, let us see if we can wrap this round of debates up with some
conclusions:
*** Can we now, with what we unearthed with these debates, agree that
Sandip Dutta's charge that " ONLY --- a few Axomiya officers and
politicians have become rich at the expense of these villagers" is at least
BASELESS, if not entirely malicious, designed to paint Oxomiya disaffections
as THEIR own damn fault?
And thus, YOUR attempt to defend SD's charge also is without merit?
*** However you DID bring out certain 'mitigating circumstances' to MY
addendum that Indian big contractors / consultants are the larger
beneficiaries of Assam and Indian govt. corruption; namely:
# These big Indian beneficiaries indulge in corrupt practices
ONLY because Assam govt. officials do; that they are helpless
victims
FORCED to REACT to the corrupt Assamese, in the same vein of
Nerobhai
Modi's invocation of Newton's Third Law, which portrays Gujaratis
as
*inanimate objects* that REACTED to Godhra 'incitement'.
# That by NOT RISING AGAINST and abetting Assam Govt. corruption
by
default, the entire Oxomiya 'jaati' is also guilty of incubating
and spreading its own disaffections. That it is their own damn
fault,
even though YOU could not, or would not TELL us WHAT they could do
to change things under the prevailing system.
# That Assam is unique in its depravity -- that the corruption
of the people of Assam is almost complete, and thus they have
forfeited
the right to complain about Indians stealing them blind.
I will let readers make their own judgements about whether the above
'mitigating circumstances' are truly mitigating or actually damning to the
object of your
defense-- the Indian govt..
c-da :-).
At 3:01 PM -0600 11/24/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
C'da,
>>Assam contracts are often given to 'non-Assamese' contractors for
several >reasons.
>*** That is NOT the issue.
Why so? Don't we need to know why Assam is forced to look elsewhere for
contractors?
>The issue is HOW they get them.
Companies like Larsen & Tubro or any of the big-wigs in India go thru the
same process of bidding in every state.
They also have competition (amongst themselves). They also are willing to
pay under the table if required to acquire a contract.
The question comes up: Are there vulnerable Axomia chief enggs? The
problem in Assam in particular is a little different.
It is highly possible for a project not done at all but the allocated
money (as much as possible) eaten up.
I still go back to basics - if all the controls are with the Assamese, why
do we fall back into forgiving ourselves
- not our fault, but it is the fault of those corrupt Larsen or Brakes
India guys. We were forced to take that bribe (it was just too much to
resist).
> If they get them thru the sheer power of the legendary Indian
>meritocracy, then "--few Axomiya officers--" , much less the >entire
Oxomiya jaati -- would not get to keep that 40 of the 60/40 >arrangement,
and would not rile the likes of Sandip Dutta or >yourself, would it?
>*** Finally, what is the origin of the 30/70, changed to 40/60, and now
probably running at 50/50 ? Is it also an uniquely >Oxomiya invention ?
You are right, they probably work with a 30/70 rate (in Assam, 70 being
the "take" or cost of doing buisiness).
Years ago, I read this report: It listed Assam as being the most expensive
state to trade. That is one reason, the prices are higher (and service
qualities the lowest possible).
No, the Oxomiyas did not invent these ratios - but looks like they have
perfected it. I have heard, in many projects, 0/100.
That is absolutely nothing gets done (everything is done in the paperwork
though)
>>The solution is for Assamese themselves to want a change, they must be
able to >define corruption as something that is >>detrimental to the state,
and not >something that just happens. The solution lies firmly with the
Assamese with >not wanting >>to tolerate anything that will hurt their
state.
>*** You disappoint me so Ram! Is this any answer ? Even an utterly
'hwja', /bhwda', 'dhwdor-posola', 'ignorant villager' could do >better than
that :-).
C'da - if the Assamese themselves do not want it and they put forward the
'upai nai', 'ki nu korim' or 'kopal ot ji likha' solutions for all these,
thenall they have done is give their blessings to corrupt practices all over
Assam. They have made it a norm
--Ram
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