Ram:
>You are comparing apples to oranges in this situation.
By jove you got it :-).
But why selectively here, and not in:
> >Why don't we see insurgent groups in any of the
> >advanced countries? Do you believe, any any of them
> >would want to break away from success?
And I have
>always supported more autonomy for states in India
Tsk, tsk---the honchos at Hastinapur did not listen, did they
:-)?
I thought your
implication in an earlier post was that economics has
>nothing to do with the cries for freedom (in the NE).
Yet another one of those statements assigned to me,but something
I NEVER said.
Because I always knew that it was NOT about economic
development alone and argued so right here in Assam Net. It is
you folks who dumbed things down to
rupees and paisas. I know why though. It is so much easier to
deal with money, and we can always place the blame for having no money
to laziness of the kharkhowas :-).
Look at Santanu's comments. He is another person who always
understood what it has been about.
c-da
At 2:52 PM -0800 1/5/05, ram Sarangapani wrote:
C'da,
> There are aren't they? But they don't hold the
> Federal Govt. responsible. They do not charge the
>Feds with step-motherly treatment. They don't accuse
>them of ignoring them or exploiting them. They hold
>the feds responsible for a lot of things, but none
> whatsoever the Indian union's constituents do.
You are comparing apples to oranges in this situation.
The US system of governance is totally different. The
states do have more autonomy than India. And I have
always supported more autonomy for states in India. So
the question of step-motherly treatment does not come
about here - the states are responsible for their
success or failure to a large extent.
Inspite of this, states like California complain that
states like New Mexico get more than they contribute.
Further, states in the US have also whined about not
getting enough funds promised by the Feds for Homeland
Security and first responders. Some of the states feel
that other states got better treatment(funding) than
others. Right or wrong, that is the preception.
In an emerging economy like India, the pressures are
greater and there is not enough of the pie to go
around to everyone's satisfaction - so, naturally the
there is a food fight.
>They do not charge the >Feds with step-motherly
>treatment
What does step-motherly treatment mean? Has it
anything to do with economics? I thought your
implication in an earlier post was that economics has
nothing to do with the cries for freedom (in the NE).
My contention still is economic development and growth
has a lot to do with such unrests.
--Ram
--- Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Ram:
>
>
> You have made a bunch of comments that won't hold up
> under scrutiny.
> But that is for later. Let me just ask you this:
>
>
> >Why don't we see insurgent groups in any of the
> >advanced countries? Do you believe, any any of them
> >would want to break away from success?
>
>
> Are there no less developed states or groups in the
> USA for example?
>
> There are aren't they? But they don't hold the
> Federal Govt.
> responsible. They do not charge the Feds with
> step-motherly
> treatment. They don't accuse them of ignoring them
> or exploiting
> them. They hold the feds responsible for a lot of
> things, but none
> whatsoever the Indian union's constituents do.
>
>
> Why do you think is the reason?
>
>
> c-da
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> At 1:54 PM -0800 1/5/05, ram Sarangapani wrote:
> >Hi Umesh,
> >
> >There are many reasons for any kind of unrest. Many
> of
> >the root causes are because of economics. without
> >growth and development, there are fewer jobs,
> >businesses don't thrive well and so. Then there
> arises
> >questions like 'have we been overlooked' or why did
> >xyz area get these benefits (and not us).
> >
> >In fact if you look into the main reasons why a
> number
> >of ethinic groups are demanding that they be
> declared
> >as scheduled caste/tribe or OBC, you will find
> >economic factors again. These groups (right or
> wrong)
> >want certain quotas to benefiit them for
> >jobs/education. And they may have a valid case as
> many
> >such were marginalized at some point.
> >
> >My point simply is this. Unrests arise more often
> than
> >not because of economic problems. Later on many
> such
> >movements will try to rationalize this as being
> >patriotic, religious or even color.
> >
> >What galls me is that some are still trying to
> justify
> >some of these by totally discounting economics and
> >potraying it as something else.
> >
> >However, I do think other factors like ethinicity,
> >religion, language etc all contribute to unrest.
> But
> >if the economics were right, few groups would want
> to
> >get off the gravy train.
> >
> >Why don't we see insurgent groups in any of the
> >advanced countries? Do you believe, any any of them
> >would want to break away from success? There are of
> >course cases like some groups in Texas who want
> their
> >own homeland (Texas) - but most will agree they are
> >off the deep end.
> >
> >--Ram da
> >
> >--- umesh sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >> To an extent I agree with Ram-da.
> >>
> >> But birds don't want to live in golden cages
> either
> >> - if you make it too stifling for them.
> >>
> >> For example, this Earth is our cage but we don't
> >> want to leave it, but if we are confined to our
> room
> >> only -we would start jumping - even with all the
> >> delicacies and sensual pleasures at our
> disposal.
> >>
> >> I don't know where we all stand on this.
> >>
> >> Umesh
> >>
> >> Ram-da wrote:
> >>
> >> economic problems are the root cause of
> >> alienations, specially in the case of the NE.
> >>
> >> If Assam/NE was a well-developed area, there
> would
> >> be
> >> far fewer young men/women wanting to join some
> >> insurgent group.
> >>
> >> ram Sarangapani <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> C'da
> >>
> >>
> >> >Will featuring in the national anthem salve
> >> > those kharkhowa hurts, if not eradicate them?
> >>
> >> Thats a big jumb to conclusions. Nobody has said
> >> that.
> >> You are just putting words into my mouth.
> >>
> >> > Does not even rhyme. It would be a an anthem
> >> > singer's nightmare.
> >>
> >> Heh! heh! heh!. You seemed to have done a pretty
> >> good
> >> job. I will buy your rendition any time -:)
> >>
> >> >Incidentally, one of the most glaring omissions
> or
> >> >ignorances some of you demonstrated last week
> about
> >> >Assam's alienations were your beliefs that it
> was
> >> >all about economic development or lack of it.
> >> >Shows how much you guys are out of it.
> > >
> >> So, please do tell us (wayward folks) whats it
> all
> >> about (other than economics).
> >>
> >> IMHO, economic problems are the root cause of
> >> alienations, specially in the case of the NE.
> You,
> >> yourself have lobbed numerous salvos at the
> Center,
> >> the Hindi-belt etc for the lack of development
> or
> > > growth in the NE.
> >> What about the ULFA or other insurgent groups in
> the
> >> NE? What MOTIVATED them to want a separation?
> >> Are you telling me that it was all because of
> >> 'identity', 'patriotism' etc.
> >>
> >> If Assam/NE was a well-developed area, there
> would
> >> be
> >> far fewer young men/women wanting to join some
> >> insurgent group. Identity, patriotism etc do
> play a
> >> role. In my opinion, they help form cohesion,
> >> Assamesenss, or to basically to go rah, rah
> (feel
> >> good) and garner support for a movement.
> >>
> >> I think, for all your belief in 'substance', you
> >> have
> >> forgotten the ROOT problems of lack of
> >> development/growth, the other major factor is
> the
> >> need
> >> to have 'power'.
> >>
> >> If you were to look into most of the
> >> infractions/insurgencies have root causes in
> >> economics
> >> or power plays. Religion too has played a role.
> But
> >> even there the root cause somehow points to
> >> economics.
> >>
> >> Lastly,
> >> >But can having a statue of Lachit Borphukan, a
> >> >symbolic recognition of kharkhowa martial
> legacy
>
=== message truncated ===
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