David,
I appreciate that there may be some internal IBM conversations about what the company's strategy for Ajax tooling will be. But at the risk of stating the obvious, ATF (and WTP for that matter) is an Eclipse community project, not an IBM one. We expect that conversations about strategy, architecture, scheduling, etc. happen openly and transparently. Giving the community a "heads up" about major changes (e.g. dropping the Personality framework) is not the same thing as having a transparent conversation about them. So I look forward to the beginning of the community planning conversation. That will be a wonderful opportunity to solicit contributions from other sources, look for opportunities to increase diversity, and to push ATF to the next level of community engagement. Mike Milinkovich Office: +1.613.224.9461 x228 Mobile: +1.613.220.3223 [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David M Williams Sent: Friday, August 10, 2007 12:50 AM To: AJAX Toolkit Framework discussion Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; AJAX Toolkit Framework discussion Subject: [wtp-pmc] Re: [atf-dev] Open Meetings and getting the Source Code > We are probably one or two months away from laying out our plans. > > Could you, perhaps, work on those plans in public? Bjorn, and others reading these lists, I'm sure it'll come as not too much of a surprise, that part of anyone's "Eclipse Planning" involves some "Company Planning" as well. So, that latter part is not fully open, naturally. In fact, Robert wanted to say more but I asked him not too, simply because I know our IBM planning still has to move further along. Once it does, then the more open part will begin. As far as I know this is the way all Eclipse Projects operate (and it just so happens ATF is on a bit of a different schedule than some others). I say all this, of course, just to explain that the delay is due to myself and IBM, not Robert or the ATF team! And I know we all wish myself and IBM were faster ... but ... you know that's not going to happen! :) In the mean time, as we say in our WTP plan, "The Eclipse and WTP community should feel free to query and add to ATF's enhancement requests, if anyone has any specific requests or contributions they'd like to document". But on the general topic of openness, we all take your general comments to heart, and had a good discussion of "lowering barriers" at the last WTP PMC meeting. It is our concern that many projects (in WTP and elsewhere, not just ATF) have too many barriers to adoption and contributions ... and we all know this is one of your <http://eclipse-projects.blogspot.com/2007/04/why-cant-i-contribute.html> documented concerns too. Our WTP PMC action item is to develop a "check list" which we can use to help assess how all our projects are doing, and how they might further lower barriers to adoption and contributions. Of course, this also will probably move slower than everyone would like, but we will make progress, and we appreciate your continued support. Bjorn Freeman-Benson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 08/09/2007 11:11 PM Please respond to AJAX Toolkit Framework discussion <[email protected]> To Robert Goodman/Austin/[EMAIL PROTECTED] cc [EMAIL PROTECTED], AJAX Toolkit Framework discussion <[email protected]> Subject Re: [atf-dev] Open Mettings and getting the Source Code Bob, I would of responded to you sooner, but have been on vacation. No problem - I'm all for vacations - Americans should take more of them (myself included!) I will work on improving the communication to the open source community. ...The team has announce two of this items to the ATF Dev forum (Dropping of the Personality and Zimbra support) to get community feedback. I saw that - thanks for taking those steps. We are probably one or two months away from laying out our plans. Could you, perhaps, work on those plans in public? On the dev mailing list and the wiki? The more public you are about the way you develop the plans, the better the project's reputation for transparency will be. So rather than waiting one or two months to lay out a draft plan, start with a wiki page today and have everyone work on the story in public - set a date of two months for a finished plan and that everything in interim is just work-in-progress, but do it public... Thanks. - Bjorn _______________________________________________ atf-dev mailing list [email protected] https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/atf-dev
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