magiccarpetride;610436 Wrote: > With all due respect, I don't understand what's the purpose of these > tests. There are four possible scenarios here: > > 1. You present me with the results of the test, and the results claim > that there are differences between modded and the unmodded Touch. I, > however, cannot hear any differences. In that case, what's the point in > me knowing that some far fetched measuring methodology produces > different results if I can't hear the differences anyway? > > 2. You present me with the results of the test, and the results claim > that there are differences between modded and the unmodded Touch. I do > hear the differences. In that case, what's the point in me knowing that > some far fetched measuring methodology produces different results when I > can already hear the differences myself? > > 3. You present me with the results of the test, and the results claim > there there are no differences between modded and the unmodded Touch. > I, however, hear the differences between the two. In that case, what's > the point in me knowing that some far fetched measuring methodology > does not produce different results when I clearly hear the differences > myself? > > 4. You present me with the results of the test, and the results claim > there there are no differences between modded and the unmodded Touch. I > also cannot hear the differences between the two. In that case, what's > the point in me knowing that some far fetched measuring methodology > does not produce different results when I also cannot hear differences > myself? > > The above charade sounds like a colossal waste of time, no matter how > you put it. Wouldn't your expertise be put to a better use if you would > devote your time to discovering the mods that could improve the sound > quality (sort of like Soundcheck already did)?
O.K...so this is a fair question and civilly, put, thank you. If I may put a few words in Phil's mouth. There is a portion of the audio folks that, in many cases, put empiricism ahead of the subjective. In other words, they measure it first and then decide if they like what they hear. It sounds a lot like how several speaker and dac designers I've read about go about their work. They design to a specific set of measurment goals which takes them so far, and then they tweak using their ears. Since I have no technical ability or understanding, my only real option is to try something, listen, and decide subjectively if there is a difference. If someone undertakes to make objective analyses that either confirms my subjective evaluation or doesn't, then my own brand of critical thinking--based on the subjective and however much objective I choose to incorporate---will help me decide whether or not to keep said device or mod or not. Phil's just approaching soundcheck's mods from the other end of the spectrum---measure first to see if he can see any empirical change and then, if so, he'll have a listen on his personal audio equipment to see if his particular set of ears/brain can actually hear something. I do not believe it's intended as a criticism or attempt to refute---simply a scientist's perfectly normal and accepted approach to testing any new theory. This is as normal to Phil as it is to you and I to just plug it in and have a listen. It is hopefully neither a charade nor a waste of time---though it is Phil's time and it would most certainly be up to him to decide whether or not he is wasting it. The folks here---Phil, John Swenson, Robin, mynb, and others have probably kept any number of us from wasting various sums of money on snake oil and, for that, I am eternally grateful. Soundcheck's mods are no risk---free and can be tossed away if they bear no fruit. How wonderful is that!?? Frankly, as long as there's no inherent bias from the get-go, I see nothing inherently wrong with either yours or Phil's approach. And, as I've stated elsewhere, I suspect that, in this case, the resolution---if there is to be one at all---lies in the middle somewhere. There are measurable--but not earth-shatteringly so--differences that different people will perceive differently with their inumerable different combinations and permutations of equipment. And, to soundcheck...again a huge thank you. IMHO, there IS a positive difference in the sounds coming out of my speakers. I am amazed by the patience and abilities of both you and others in continually fiddling in order to try to make this odd little world a better place! -- rgro Rick System information ------------------------ Main: PS Audio Quintet > Touch (wired) via spdif coax > CA DacMagic > Marantz PM8003 > VA Mozart Grands > REL Acoustics R305. Home Theatre: SBR (Wired) > Pioneer VSX 919 > Energy Take 5 Classic 5.1. SBS 7.5.3 r31815 running on a Vortexbox Appliance, V 1.7. Touch w/Hardware V.5. Touch: FW 7.5.3 r9283. Duet: FW 67. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ rgro's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=34348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=84742 _______________________________________________ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
