Leo Simons wrote:
>Not that I have time for this, but I do feel it is neccessary to throw
>in some copper pieces here, especially as pete probably doesn't feel
>much like it anymore =)
>
>
>>I think that Phoenix is an very good program.
>>I think that Fortress and Merlin have a very good potential.
>>I'm sure that the multiple avalon repositories are a serious problem for
>>Avalon, because they fracture the community instead of keeping it together.
>>
>> I don't like that Peter Donald thinks that Phoenix is "his code".
>>
>
>He wrote most of it. It is mostly code he wrote. So you could call it
>"his code".
>
You could .. I don't - its Avalon community project code.
>
>
>Phoenix has gone through a gazillion different permutiations. A lot has
>been tried. Sometimes new people propose something, and it has already
>been done and it has been found lacking, so a -1 follows.
>
>That's pete, I think.
>
>
>> I think that Peter Donald is a very good coder.
>>
>>Heck, he has done large chunks of Phoenix, redefined big parts of
>>Avalon, and is helping to make Ant2.
>>
>> I think that Peter Donald is not good at discussing
>> things with other people.
>>
>>How come everyone else on this list comes to an agreement at some point
>>while Peter lately is really hard on -1s and "the sky will fall"?
>>
>
>I'm not sure. I do know that he is right more often than it seems. You
>will also read "I told you so"s in his posts, and he is sometimes right
>where all others are wrong.
>
In reality we are all right most of the time.
Pete is nothing special - just more opinionated than most.
>
>
>Why all the -1s lately, I don't know. It seems Pete is suffering from
>the symptoms found in many OSS developers that have been around for a
>long time: They get tired of the discussion, the repeated explanations
>time and time again, and just do their own thing (often just write
>code). When the community complains a lot, they leave in the end.
>
>Or, he could just be very busy =)
>
On this occasion I have to disagree with you. Pete has the time to
address the issues being raised. He's demonstrated this fact by going
to the effort of deleting bug fixes needed to resolve James runtime
failures. These are not old issue - they are new isues - but Pete is
choosing to ignore them and play a political game.
Pete's recent actions appear inconsitent and unrelated to the technical
reality of what's going on. In this context one needs to balance the
credibility that Pete has established over the years against his
immediate personal agenda.
>>How come since Peter came to Avalon have important Avalon coders and
>>thinkers left the group after heated discussions with Peter Donald?
>>
>
>dunno. I'm sure there's many sides to that.
>
>A more general point to add: software full of compromise is usually not
>the best. There's many jokes about that, one goes something like:
>
>A management executive is harassing one of his programmers who is
>working on an experimental new operating system, because the OS is
>behind schedule. When pressed, the programmer simply states that it is
>impossible to meet the deadline and he says it will take 2 more months
>to complete the software.
>After raving like a madman for a while, the executive says: "Okay, I'll
>hire 2 more programmers so we can make the deadline." The programmer
>responds: "No, then it will take 4 more months". Very annoyed with this
>delay, the executive in the end hires 100 more developers to finish the
>project in time.
>Windows still needs to come out of beta stage.
>
>We made a compromise when we released excalibur (cocoon needed it),
>which was stupid in hindsight. We made a compromise with the
>ComponentSelector, which was also pretty stupid. There's more examples.
>Pete was, in hindsight, right on both.
>
We can go down that track and we can but if wew do then look at the
other side of story.
Pete -1'ed the release of the Avalon Framework and was quickly corrected
by the intervention of a member of the PMC. Pete changes his mind too -
just like we all do from time to time - look at marker interfaces, look
at ComponentManager. Yes, his opinions are valuable - but so are the
opinions of all of the committers on Avalon - no more, no less.
Cheers, Steve.
--
Stephen J. McConnell
OSM SARL
digital products for a global economy
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.osm.net
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