The Baha'i Studies Listserv
I understand that what you are saying makes sense from your
perspective. But then how should a non-Bahai refer to the various
groups which all claim to be Bahais and follow the teachings of
Bahaullah?
On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Tim Nolan <tnola...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
>
> "Haifan Baha'is" is a misnomer because it implies that those Baha'is who are
> faithful
> to the covenmant are just one of several "legitimate" Baha'i groups.
> That is not the case. The Baha'i community that follows the covenant, and
> turns to the Universal House of Justice for guidance, is the *only*
> legitimate Baha'i group.
>
> Tim
>
> All good art is about something deeper than it admits.
> --Roger Ebert
>
> ________________________________
> From: Stephen Gray <skg_z...@yahoo.com>
> To: Baha'i Studies <bahai-st@list.jccc.edu>
> Sent: Tue, September 14, 2010 1:46:40 PM
> Subject: Re: Baha'i Review
>
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
>
> I didn't know who Juan Cole was, just that Wikipedia had a link to his page
> from an article.
>
> Is he reallly an enemy of the faith?
>
> Are Haifan Baha'is really faithful to the Covenant?
>
> ________________________________
> From: Jeanine H. <jeanin...@earthlink.net>
> To: Baha'i Studies <bahai-st@list.jccc.edu>
> Sent: Tue, September 14, 2010 10:50:58 AM
> Subject: Re: Baha'i Review
>
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
>
> Dear Susan Brill de Ramirez,
>
> The following is just my opinion.
>
> Part of the problem may be that this is only a partly-moderated list. Mark
> needs to give the co-moderator the ability to remove posts if he is not
> going to monitor this list, and long practice seems to show that he is not.
> Otherwise, Covenant Breaker and enemy of the Faith material has, and will
> be, occasionally posted here. The friends who are responding in this case
> are correctly identifying that the scholar discussed below fits into this
> category. The desire to point out the severe problems with this person stems
> from a desire to protect the Faith and individuals who don't know the
> history of such people. That means we will have, de facto, negative
> responses to such people and materials. It is possible that the atmosphere
> may not be to everyone's liking, either in the first instance of bringing up
> the issue or, then, in the response. It is not simply a "live and let live"
> when there are corrosive individuals who have repeatedly slandered the
> Institutions and have sought leadership; that's the first negative. If you
> don't know the history, if the discussion feels like individuals backbiting,
> you can email Dr. Maneck who has had to deal with these people repeatedly.
> There's a reason you see what you see. There was a Baha'i list that was
> created for, and dealt specifically with, scholarly study of individuals who
> attack the Faith and where such a discussion is unreservedly appropriate,
> but I don't know what's happening with that list these days.
>
> Having said that, the originators of this list can clarify what purpose is
> served in these instances. Unless the originator permits removal of posts,
> there is no ultimate moderation function. That is a shame, because this kind
> of issue has come up from time to time in virtually every Baha'i list I've
> read. That is the nature of the disease of opposition to the Covenant. I,
> personally, skip the discussions that I find unpleasant and read the more
> enlightening ones. The moderators can clarify the purpose of the list,
> altho' I suspect I could just look around at all the links at the bottom and
> figure it out. ;-)
>
> Yours,
>
> Jeanine
>
> On 9/14/2010 10:19 AM, Brill de Ramirez, Susan wrote:
>
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
> In reviewing the posts over the last number of weeks, I have a request:
>
> Would the moderators of this listserve please remind us all of the
> purpose for this discussion group? I would greatly appreciate that. When
> individuals come together in good spirit to learn together, that is a
> gift. When we can do this across great geographic distances via this
> listserve, that is also a great benefit to us all.
>
> There is such a fine line between argument for the sake of argument and
> disagreement in the course of learning. There is also a fine line
> between being informed about the work of various scholars and descending
> into the realm of scholarly" backbiting.
>
> I read the attachment that maligns the recent scholarly work of
> Professor Juan Cole. I regret that I did so. It is not my business why
> or why not a fellow scholar receives a position . . . unless it is in a
> department over which I have some jurisdiction or involvement. None of
> us are perfect; professors make mistakes, some small, some large. If
> Professor Cole has produced some work that is weak, then I would rather
> recognize the good scholarly work that he has done and is still doing.
> If he was a Baha'i, but is no longer, that too is not my business. That
> is between him and Baha'u'llah. I would much rather read about the
> positive contributions that various Baha'i scholars are making that can
> help us to grow in our understandings of the Faith and the world.
> Negative attacks about scholars, negative attacks about the Faith, these
> do not serve the larger purpose of a unified and engaged search for
> knowledge.
>
> To look always at the good and not at the bad. If a
> man has ten good qualities and one bad one, to look at the
> ten and forget the one; and if a man has ten bad qualities
> and one good one, to look at the one and forget the ten.
> Never to allow ourselves to speak one unkind word
> about another, even though that other be our enemy.
> ("Abdu'l-Baha cited by Dr. J.E. Esslemont in _Baha'u'llah and the New
> Era_, 83)
>
> Does this not apply also to scholars? We certainly must correct errors
> in the scholarship, but not the errors in the person.
>
> I will look forward to clarification regarding the purpose of this
> listserve so that I can decide whether to continue my involvement
> (whether posting or simply reading).
>
> My sincere regards to you all,
>
> Susan
> _______________________________________
> Susan Berry Brill de Ramirez, Ph.D., M.B.A., M.A., B.A.
> Caterpillar Inc. Professor of English
>
> Department of English
> Bradley University
> 1501 W. Bradley Avenue
> Peoria, IL 61625 U.S.A.
>
> (309) 677-3888
> (309) 677-4560 (fax)
> br...@bumail.bradley.edu
> http://www.bradley.edu/las/eng/faculty/bios/ramirez.shtml
> http://www.bradley.edu/academic/galleryofexcellence/cp-brill.shtml
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bounce-526362-22...@list.jccc.edu
> [mailto:bounce-526362-22...@list.jccc.edu] On Behalf Of Susan Maneck
> Sent: Tuesday, September 14, 2010 9:23 AM
> To: Baha'i Studies
> Subject: Re: Baha'i Review
>
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
>
>
> This is interesting reading.
> http://www.keshertalk.com/archives/2006/07/juancoleyale.php
>
>
> I have to agree with this writer of this blog that Juan is inclined to
> conspiracy theories. As some of you know I initially sided with Juan
> when he first broke with the administration, but I began to have
> second thoughts as a result of his verbal tirades. When I began to
> pull away he sent me private messages saying he believed the Baha'i
> Faith had been taken over by a secret cabal going back to Mason Remey
> and Horace Holley.
>
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