The Baha'i Studies Listserv I guess what I would suggest is that if the reality underneath the names is really the same, then the names don't matter at all. (including the name Bahaullah). The only thing that matters is getting access to that reality. And so if we are really talking about the unchanging Faith of God as being the important thing, then that should be accessible from the best parts of the Jewish tradition, or the best parts of the Christian tradition, or the best parts of Islamic tradition etc. And that if you "cling" to Bahaullah its possible to not see the truths which non-Bahais may already have.
On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 10:32 PM, Naison Jones <naistrada...@gmail.com> wrote: > The Baha'i Studies Listserv > > > A seeker must put aside all love and hate. Love because what he loves can > blind him to finding the beloved in another form because he is too attached > to the old form. > if I love the symbol of the cross and am so in love with Jesus dying on the > cross and his self-less sacrifice I will not as easily be able to recognise > Baha'u'llah he did not die on the cross. > If similarly I am in love with Muhammad in love with the idea of this desert > nomab guiding people and declaring holy war and winning these battles or > whatever else pertains to this revelation how can I recognise one who says > "Holy war is abolished"? > Love can be a veil as much as hate. > A true seeker puts aside his love and hate and seeks only for the reality in > all things. > And since the reality of the prophets is the same, one who is detached from > all else save him should be able to come upon the revelation "Swift as a > twinkling of the eye" (that is from ruhi book 2 I think). > Good luck. > > > On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 12:18 AM, Gilberto Simpson > <gilberto.simp...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> The Baha'i Studies Listserv >> On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 3:31 AM, Khazeh <aqu...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote: >> > The Baha'i Studies Listserv >> >> > Again Firouz said >> >> And we don't think non-Baha'is go to hell >> >> > Whereupon Gilberto replied: >> >> > That's not exactly true. Isn't recognizing the Manifestation for the >> > current >> > age seen as a major obligation according to the Bahá’ís? >> >> > From The summons of the Lord of Hosts >> > >> > Suriy-i-Haykal >> > ***It is even as ye witness in the present day: those who have >> > disbelieved >> > in God and joined partners with Him cling to a single one of Our Names, >> > and >> > are debarred from recognizing Him Who is the Creator of all Names. We >> > testify that such men are of a truth amongst the people of the Fire.** >> > >> > Firouz can reply for himself of course and others so much better >> > equipped >> > than this lowly one can engage in deep and spiritual conversation but I >> > wish >> > to make two points as I always admire Gilberto’s mind and logic. >> > >> > Firstly I will mention the second point above re the quote from the >> > Tablet >> > revealed by Baha’u’llah in the Haykal. >> > >> > Please Gilberto. >> > >> > It can be read differently. >> > >> > Baha’u’llah is here emphasizing the truth that “clinging to one name” >> > being >> > attached to one name” “idolizing one name” to the detriment of realizing >> > that He Possesses ALL Names (= > All Revelations the One Common >> > revelation), >> > THAT is the start of going away from the truth, becoming negative, >> > turning >> > away from the entirety and wholeness of Divine Revelations and becoming >> > engrossed and entrapped by shirk which is hell itself. >> > >> >> If I'm understanding you properly, I think that's a beautiful way to >> think of things. But would you be willing to say that people in the >> present day can "cling" to Bahaullah in a negative sense in the >> present day ? Can someone be a member of a particular faith without >> believing in Bahaullah without being guilty of "clinging" to their old >> faith? >> >> Or to explain with an example on the other side.. there is a blog >> which I like reading from time to time called Inspirations and >> Creative Thoughts. >> http://www.mysticsaint.info/ >> >> From what I can tell, the author is basically Muslim, from a Muslim >> family, who follows the Shadhili tariqat and believes that Muhammad is >> the last prophet. But he follows Islam in a really open-hearted way >> and values the truth wherever it appears (including the Bahai >> writings). As far as I can tell, he doesn't consider the Bab or >> Bahaullah as Manifestations or prophets, but he has an appreication of >> works like the Seven Valleys. Would you consider such a person to be >> "clinging"? >> >> __________________________________________________ >> You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:naistrada...@gmail.com >> Unsubscribe: send a blank email to >> mailto:leave-547821-2222932.41cdf54d4f0ecb51bfad2c42bd979...@list.jccc.edu >> Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to >> ly...@list.jccc.edu >> Or subscribe: >> http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st >> Baha'i Studies is available through the following: >> Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu >> Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st >> News (on-campus only) - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st >> Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net >> New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu >> > > __________________________________________________ > You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:gilberto.simp...@gmail.com > Unsubscribe: send a blank email to > mailto:leave-547839-68452.e157d5dc5efabb63696f251595c88...@list.jccc.edu > Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to > ly...@list.jccc.edu > Or subscribe: > http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st > Baha'i Studies is available through the following: > Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu > Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st > News (on-campus only) - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st > Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net > New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu __________________________________________________ You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:arch...@mail-archive.com Unsubscribe: send a blank email to mailto:leave-547952-27401.54f46e81b66496c9909bcdc2f7987...@list.jccc.edu Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to ly...@list.jccc.edu Or subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st Baha'i Studies is available through the following: Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st News (on-campus only) - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu
