Hi William, You are way braver than me ;-)
Regards, John > On Dec 1, 2015, at 2:17 PM, William Hermans <yyrk...@gmail.com> wrote: > > @John, > > So talking about all this reminds me of "back in the day", when 320MB drives > were large, and expensive. So at that time I had an 80MB Maxtor I believe it > was, and it was nearly full. Knowing one of the local shop owners in the town > I lived in ( Montgomery Alabama if memory serves ) I managed to get my hands > on a used 320M Seagate that had known marked bad sectors. For a good > price(very cheap of course ). > > I used this drive for a couple years, and it was still functional when I > stopped using it. Once in a while I did have to fire up spinrite, to fix > things when the drive would lose it's brains . . . > > Anyway, all that health stuff does not really matter, until the drive starts > failing, with known bad sectors. Even then, software can most of the time, > fix these issues. With that said, this is not something a "normal" person > expects to do when paying good money for new hardware. > > I have one of the newer 5TB Seagate drives that comes in an USB 3.0 > enclosure. It works great. The only problem I've had with it so far is that > when copying file from itself, to itself, it makes that well known "bad" seek > "clunk". Every time I hear that noise it makes me cringe. . . needless to > say, I do not copy paste files from it, to it. Which is easy to fix, just > drag the file to the new location . . . > > Perfect situation ? Well no, but the drive also cost 40%-50% less than what > the competition was selling 4TB drives for, at that time. > > On Tue, Dec 1, 2015 at 11:30 AM, John Syne <john3...@gmail.com > <mailto:john3...@gmail.com>> wrote: > My guess is that they are not measuring those parameters (Latency). Regarding > Health rating, I believe that has to do with the number of starts and hours > of service. More important to me are the read/write/seek/sector errors. On a > few month old Seagate Barracuda drives, these numbers are large, so I don’t > know at what point those numbers become too big and I have to replace the > drive. > > > Regards, > John > > > > >> On Dec 1, 2015, at 5:31 AM, mickeyf <mic...@thesweetoasis.com >> <mailto:mic...@thesweetoasis.com>> wrote: >> >> My ignorance of this stuff is very nearly 100%, but why does "Issues found : >> 0" equate to 'Only' "Overall Health Rating 89.9%" ? >> >> Also, how do they get : >> "Latency Time (Read) : 0 ns" >> "Latency Time (Write) : 0 ns" >> >> ...unless this was programmed by the "rogue engineers" at Volkswagon? >> Surely it has latency > 0? >> >> Real questions, not facetious, just curious. >> >> >> On Sunday, November 29, 2015 at 2:32:22 PM UTC-8, john3909 wrote: >> Hi William, >> >> My comment was just a heads up so other developer’s don’t get take a hit >> like I did. Just look at your disk SMART data and you will be surprised by >> the number of errors on those disks. Here is an example of SMART info from >> one of my 4TB WD disks I use with TimeMachine. As you can see, 0 errors in >> the log. On my development system, I use 1TB Seagate SSD drives and they >> work great. >> >> Last Checked : November 29, 2015 2:25:14 PM PST >> Last Checked (ISO 8601 format) : 2015-11-29T14:25:14 >> >> Advanced SMART Status : OK >> Overall Health Rating : GOOD 89.9% >> Overall Performance Rating : GOOD 89.9% >> Issues found : 0 >> >> Serial Number : WD-WCC4E0HHFLY1 >> WWN Id : 5 0014ee 260fbf0bd >> Volumes : TimeMachine1 >> Device Path : /dev/disk4 >> Total Capacity : 4.0 TB (4,000,787,030,016 Bytes) >> Model Family : Western Digital Red >> Model : WDC WD40EFRX-68WT0N0 >> Firmware Version : 82.00A82 >> Drive Type : HDD 5400 rpm >> >> Power On Time : 5,078 hours (7 months 1 days 14 hours) >> Power Cycles Count : 54 >> Current Power Cycle Time : 22.1 hours >> >> >> >> === DEVICE CAPABILITIES === >> S.M.A.R.T. support enabled : yes >> DriveDx Active Diagnostic Config : Base config [hdd.default] >> Sector Logical Size : 512 >> Sector Physical Size : 4096 >> Physical Interconnect : SATA >> Removable : no >> Ejectable : no >> ATA Version : ACS-2 (minor revision not indicated) >> SATA Version : SATA 3.0, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 6.0 Gb/s) >> Bay # : 1 >> I/O Path : >> IOService:/AppleACPIPlatformExpert/PCI0@0/AppleACPIPCI/PEG1@1,1/IOPP/UPSB@0/IOPP/DSB2@4/IOPP/UPS0@0/IOPP/pci-bridge@3/IOPP/pci1b21,612@0/AppleAHCI/PRT0@0/IOAHCIDevice@0/AppleAHCIDiskDriver/IOAHCIBlockStorageDevice >> Attributes Data Structure Revision : 16 >> SMART Command Transport (SCT) flags : 0x703d >> SCT Status supported : yes >> SCT Feature Control supported : yes >> SCT Data Table supported : yes >> Error logging capabilities : 0x1 >> Self-tests supported : yes >> Offline Data Collection capabilities : 0x7b >> Offline Data Collection status : 0x0 >> Auto Offline Data Collection flags : 0x0 >> [Known device ]: yes >> [Drive State Flags ]: 0x0 >> >> >> === CURRENT POWER CYCLE STATISTICS === >> Data Read : 2.2 GB >> Data Written : 3.5 GB >> Data Read/Write Ratio : 0.62 >> Average Throughput (Read) : 1.2 MB/s >> Average Throughput (Write) : 932.4 KB/s >> >> Operations (Read) : 175,372 >> Operations (Write) : 153,554 >> Operations Read/Write Ratio : 1 >> Throughput per operation (Read) : 12.9 KB/Op >> Throughput per operation (Write) : 23.6 KB/Op >> >> Latency Time (Read) : 0 ns >> Latency Time (Write) : 0 ns >> Retries (Read) : 0 >> Retries (Write) : 0 >> Errors (Read) : 0 >> Errors (Write) : 0 >> >> >> === PROBLEMS SUMMARY === >> Failed Indicators (life-span / pre-fail) : 0 (0 / 0) >> Failing Indicators (life-span / pre-fail) : 0 (0 / 0) >> Warnings (life-span / pre-fail) : 0 (0 / 0) >> Recently failed Self-tests (Short / Full) : 0 (0 / 0) >> I/O Errors Count : 0 (0 / 0) >> Time in Under temperature : 0 minutes >> Time in Over temperature : 0 minutes >> >> >> === IMPORTANT HEALTH INDICATORS === >> ID NAME RAW VALUE >> STATUS >> 5 Reallocated Sector Count 0 >> 100% OK >> 197 Current Pending Sectors Count 0 >> 100% OK >> 198 Offline Uncorrectable Sector Count 0 >> 100% OK >> 199 UDMA CRC Error Count 0 >> 100% OK >> >> >> === TEMPERATURE INFORMATION (CELSIUS) === >> Current Temperature : 33 >> Power Cycle Min Temperature : 27 >> Power Cycle Max Temperature : 37 >> Lifetime Min Temperature : 23 >> Lifetime Max Temperature : 49 >> Recommended Min Temperature : 0 >> Recommended Max Temperature : 60 >> Temperature Min Limit : -41 >> Temperature Max Limit : 85 >> >> >> === DRIVE HEALTH INDICATORS === >> ID | NAME | TYPE | UPDATE | >> RAW VALUE | VALUE | THRESHOLD | WORST | STATUS | >> LAST MODIFIED >> 1 Raw Read Error Rate Pre-fail online >> 0x0 200 51 200 100% OK >> 5/13/15 8:43 PM >> 3 Spin Up Time Pre-fail online >> 7,891 182 21 177 89.9% OK >> 11/29/15 2:25 PM >> 4 Start Stop Count Life-span online >> 4,129 96 0 96 96.0% OK >> 11/29/15 2:25 PM >> 5 Reallocated Sector Count Pre-fail online >> 0 200 140 200 100% OK - >> >> 7 Seek Error Rate Life-span online >> 0x0 200 0 200 100% OK - >> >> 9 Power On Hours Life-span online >> 5,078 94 0 94 94.0% OK >> 11/29/15 2:25 PM >> 10 Spin Retry Count Life-span online >> 0 100 0 100 100% OK - >> >> 11 Calibration Retry Count Life-span online >> 0 100 0 253 100% OK - >> >> 12 Power Cycle Count Life-span online >> 54 100 0 100 100% OK >> 11/28/15 4:19 PM >> 192 Power-Off Retract Count Life-span online >> 21 200 0 200 100% OK >> 11/12/15 2:02 PM >> 193 Load Cycle Count Life-span online >> 9,125 197 0 197 98.5% OK >> 11/29/15 2:25 PM >> 194 Temperature (Celsius) Life-span online >> 33 119 0 103 99.2% OK >> 11/29/15 2:25 PM >> 196 Reallocated Event Count Life-span online >> 0 200 0 200 100% OK - >> >> 197 Current Pending Sectors Count Life-span online >> 0 200 0 200 100% OK - >> >> 198 Offline Uncorrectable Sector Count Life-span offline >> 0 100 0 253 100% OK - >> >> 199 UDMA CRC Error Count Life-span online >> 0 200 0 200 100% OK - >> >> 200 Multi Zone Error Rate Life-span offline >> 0 100 0 253 100% OK - >> >> >> >> >> === DRIVE ERROR LOG === >> error log is empty >> >> >> === DRIVE SELF-TEST LOG === >> self-test log is empty >> >> >> Regards, >> John >> >> >> >> >>> On Nov 29, 2015, at 1:42 PM, William Hermans <yyr...@ <>gmail.com >>> <http://gmail.com/>> wrote: >>> >>> . . .the only purpose of a RAID backup is to prevent a single point of >>> failure (like a disk failure) resulting in lost backups. >>> >>> You do not need a RAID array to prevent a single point of failure. You take >>> those 3+ disks, put them in 3 different machines. Or even in the same >>> machine as single drives. Same difference, only less wear and tear on the >>> drives, more cost effective, and perhaps a small amount slower as singles. >>> >>> In the field you'll likely not run into any RAID 5/6 arrays. At least for >>> corporate storage. You're more likely to see RAID10, or RAID0 + 1. Because >>> there is nothing faster than striping disks, and RAID1 does not have an >>> impact on performance if set up correctly. RAID5/6 is just a way for the >>> home user to feel all warm and fuzzy . . and literally feed the companies >>> who offer the hardware for such arrays. Be it controllers, or "special" >>> hard drives . . . special software, chipsets with BS built in RAID( >>> software ). >>> >>> I still use Seagate drives(nothing but), and have no issues. Why ? Probably >>> because I do not run RAID. RAID is notorious for being hard on drives. >>> Especially RAID 5/6. I will admit, that Seagate's reputation has gone into >>> the toilette in the last 8 or so years. All their drives used to be >>> lifetime warranty. Now days I think they give 3 years . . . not even as >>> good as WD, or even Samsung SSDs . . . >>> >>> Anyway, seriously. Unless you're running a server that sees thousands+ of >>> transactions a day. You don't need RAID. But hey, don't pay attention to >>> me. . . >>> >>> >>> On Sun, Nov 29, 2015 at 1:44 PM, John Syne <john...@ <>gmail.com >>> <http://gmail.com/>> wrote: >>> That makes perfect sense. BTW, the only purpose of a RAID backup is to >>> prevent a single point of failure (like a disk failure) resulting in lost >>> backups. >>> >>> One thing to pay attention to is the MTBF numbers for disks. I was a firm >>> believer in Seagate Barracuda disk until I had a whole number of them fail >>> over a few months. Speaking Seagate tech support, they explained that the >>> SMART data on these disks showed they had more than the 3,000 hours MTBF >>> and hence I should have expected them to fail. I couldn’t believe what they >>> told me; running their disks 24 hours/day, they expected failures in 1/3 of >>> a year. They were right, look at the SMART data on Seagate disks and you >>> will see read write errors in the 10’s of thousands or more. >>> >>> After that I use Western Digital RED disks which are designed for 24/7 NAS >>> applications. Looking at the disk SMART data, I see 0 read/write errors. >>> >>> Regards, >>> John >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > On Nov 29, 2015, at 3:37 AM, c...@ <>isbd.net <http://isbd.net/> wrote: >>> > >>> > John Syne <john...@ <>gmail.com <http://gmail.com/>> wrote: >>> >> [-- text/plain, encoding quoted-printable, charset: UTF-8, 156 lines --] >>> >> >>> >> Yeah, but rsync only gives you a snapshot and not a history of your >>> >> backup. >>> >> When I really mess up, I want to go back to the state of my machine 15 >>> >> minutes ago, or two days ago. This has saved me a lot of head scratching, >>> >> trying to find out where I messed up. I really like the way timemachine >>> > >>> > I use an rsync based incremental backup system (I wrote it myself >>> > having used rsnapshot for a while, rsnapshot is OK but I think it's >>> > too complex). >>> > >>> > I do hourly incremental backups locally to another disk on my main >>> > machine and I do daily incremental backups to a remote machine. The >>> > daily remote backups get thinned out as they get older so there are >>> > daily backups for the last month, then monthly ones for 12 months, >>> > then yearly ones. >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Chris Green >>> > · >>> > >>> > -- >>> > For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss >>> > <http://beagleboard.org/discuss> >>> > --- >>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> > "BeagleBoard" group. >>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> > email to beagleboard...@ <>googlegroups.com <http://googlegroups.com/>. >>> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>> > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>> >>> -- >>> For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss >>> <http://beagleboard.org/discuss> >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "BeagleBoard" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to beagleboard...@ <>googlegroups.com <http://googlegroups.com/>. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss >>> <http://beagleboard.org/discuss> >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "BeagleBoard" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to beagleboard...@ <>googlegroups.com <http://googlegroups.com/>. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >> >> >> -- >> For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss >> <http://beagleboard.org/discuss> >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "BeagleBoard" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> <mailto:beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. > > > -- > For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss > <http://beagleboard.org/discuss> > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "BeagleBoard" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. > > > -- > For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss > <http://beagleboard.org/discuss> > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "BeagleBoard" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. -- For more options, visit http://beagleboard.org/discuss --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "BeagleBoard" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to beagleboard+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
