Sure, let's do 4 milestones. We can put the deprecation message in the developer console in M96 and perform the removal in M100.
On Thu, Sep 9, 2021 at 3:26 PM Mike West <[email protected]> wrote: > Ok. Does ~4-5 milestones (M100-101 sound good to you?) > > -mike > > > On Thu, Sep 9, 2021 at 9:20 PM Rouslan Solomakhin <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> > a deprecation period before removal isn't an unreasonable path forward. >> WDYT >> >> That sounds reasonable to us. We are planning a blog post, too, by the >> way. >> >> (Responding on behalf of Stephen and Max because they happen to be both >> OOO today.) >> >> On Thu, Sep 9, 2021 at 2:57 PM Mike West <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Given the UKM-driven manual analysis, I'm willing to believe that sites >>> using this mechanism won't crumble if it's removed. That said, the >>> deprecation in the spec that you pointed to above landed ~2 weeks ago. >>> Perhaps it's reasonable to extend developers' ability to conduct >>> transactions through this mechanism for a release or three before removing >>> it, warning in the console about the deprecation, blog posting, etc. >>> >>> Perhaps I'm being unreasonably cautious here (and I'm totally willing to >>> hear reasons that might be the case!), but it seems to me that a >>> deprecation period before removal isn't an unreasonable path forward. WDYT? >>> >>> -mike >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Sep 9, 2021 at 5:46 PM Daniel Bratell <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> When I looked around to see what other methods were available, it >>>> seemed to me like all documentation and explainers included basic-card as >>>> the standard method, and few of them used anything else. I wonder if that >>>> means that it's too early to deprecate before documentation and specs is >>>> updated to suggest alternatives. >>>> >>>> /Daniel >>>> >>>> >>>> On 2021-09-09 14:14, Stephen Mcgruer wrote: >>>> >>>> > Can you clarify what breakage may look like for sites that may rely >>>> on it? >>>> >>>> If a site was *entirely* relying on basic-card to collect credit card >>>> details from their user, it would be impossible for the user to complete >>>> their checkout. So arguably 'site completely broken' from that perspective >>>> (assuming buying a thing is the main user journey). >>>> >>>> However, such a site would also be broken on Firefox and Safari today >>>> (unless serving user-agent specific code), and sites also tend to not rely >>>> on just one approach to get paid. Sites will almost definitely have a >>>> fallback mechanism, and it will likely be invisible to the user. For >>>> example: >>>> >>>> 1. Site checks `if (window.PaymentRequest)` - passes in Chrome and >>>> Safari, fails in Firefox. >>>> 2. Site calls `new PaymentRequest([basic-card-data]).canMakePayment()` >>>> (or `show()` directly) - passes in Chrome today, fails/throws in Safari. >>>> 3. If either of #1 or #2 failed, render a fallback payment information >>>> collection flow such as a HTML form. >>>> >>>> TL;DR - we expect very few to no sites to break due to this removal, >>>> unless they're doing user-agent specific branching with no fallback >>>> mechanisms for 'what if basic-card fails'. >>>> >>>> On Thu, 9 Sept 2021 at 08:03, Yoav Weiss <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Can you clarify what breakage may look like for sites that may rely on >>>>> it? >>>>> >>>>> On Tuesday, September 7, 2021 at 2:34:46 PM UTC+2 Stephen McGruer >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> > Any usecounter stats you can share? >>>>>> >>>>>> Unfortunately no usecounters for two reasons: >>>>>> >>>>>> 1) Payment APIs in general have very low usage when compared to 'page >>>>>> loads', because the most popular sites on the web aren't merchants and so >>>>>> don't use them. For example, PaymentRequest.show is at 0.001 >>>>>> <https://chromestatus.com/metrics/feature/timeline/popularity/2895>. >>>>>> They're still very important, so we have to measure usage other ways :) >>>>>> >>>>>> 2) In particular for basic-card, it's actually just a method-type of >>>>>> PaymentRequest, so our top-level usecounters don't show it. >>>>>> >>>>>> We have internal stats that I can't share publicly due to sensitivity >>>>>> (Googlers, feel free to ping me for a link), but I can share that of >>>>>> transactions using PaymentRequest, basic-card is ~2% of all transactions >>>>>> and <1% of completed transactions. So it's a very niche feature that also >>>>>> performs poorly. >>>>>> >>>>>> Max has also done an analysis of the top 10 sites from UKM data that >>>>>> use basic-card. For 4, he couldn't get to the payments page or couldn't >>>>>> get >>>>>> it to trigger basic-card at all (possibly geographically gated), but for >>>>>> the remaining 6 he confirmed that all 6 function properly in a version of >>>>>> Chrome that has basic-card disabled (falling back to the same behavior >>>>>> they >>>>>> use for Firefox + Safari). >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, 6 Sept 2021 at 03:26, Yoav Weiss <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 3, 2021 at 4:25 PM Liquan (Max) Gu <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Contact emails [email protected], [email protected] >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Specification https://www.w3.org/TR/payment-method-basic-card/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Summary >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Deprecate the "basic-card" payment method from PaymentRequest API. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Blink component Blink>Payments >>>>>>>> <https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/list?q=component:Blink%3EPayments> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Motivation >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * Its usage is low and declining, underperforms other payment >>>>>>>> methods in time-to-checkout and completion rate and does not have >>>>>>>> improvement potential. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Any usecounter stats you can share? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * W3C's interest in it has waned. 6 participants supported the >>>>>>>> deprecation and no objection[1], and W3C has deprecated the spec[2]. >>>>>>>> [1] >>>>>>>> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-payments-wg/2021Aug/0038.html >>>>>>>> [2] https://github.com/w3c/payment-method-basic-card/pull/90/files >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Interoperability and Compatibility >>>>>>>> * Chrome is the only implementer of basic-card, so the basic-card >>>>>>>> removal from Chrome will increase interoperability. >>>>>>>> * Since no other browser implements basic-card, web developers >>>>>>>> already need workarounds to support other browsers. >>>>>>>> * Whether basic-card is supported can be detected via >>>>>>>> canMakePayment >>>>>>>> <https://w3c.github.io/payment-request/#canmakepayment-method>. >>>>>>>> Web developers normally use this to decide whether to fallback to >>>>>>>> other methods. >>>>>>>> * We have checked the few top sites via UKM - they all appear to >>>>>>>> work with basic-card disabled because they fallback to other methods >>>>>>>> to get >>>>>>>> payment info. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Tracking bug https://crbug.com/1209835 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Estimated milestones M96 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Link to entry on the Chrome Platform Status >>>>>>>> https://chromestatus.com/feature/5730051011117056 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This intent message was generated by Chrome Platform Status >>>>>>>> <https://www.chromestatus.com/>. >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAEWPi2sswphwqEnCGgwwNOr_F5j8V%3Dc5ZQ7Kz6h2gK%2Bki2A6aw%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAEWPi2sswphwqEnCGgwwNOr_F5j8V%3Dc5ZQ7Kz6h2gK%2Bki2A6aw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "payments-dev" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/payments-dev/CAL5BFfUaHsXJEEwN3JO2MSGw9WHsVt5nszPPscKh9mBrRt5U1g%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/payments-dev/CAL5BFfUaHsXJEEwN3JO2MSGw9WHsVt5nszPPscKh9mBrRt5U1g%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CADY3MafMcTV1GOHS62bHd%2BK%2BH1ftH0pBZL_1k77GWJqK8o9Uvg%40mail.gmail.com >>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CADY3MafMcTV1GOHS62bHd%2BK%2BH1ftH0pBZL_1k77GWJqK8o9Uvg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/25df3c17-3cf3-695a-451f-ef1007581d53%40gmail.com >>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/25df3c17-3cf3-695a-451f-ef1007581d53%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "payments-dev" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/payments-dev/CAKXHy%3De-AdXxo8CtZrSk-iPN05KmJ0_FWHOw5duyBXFGR58oGA%40mail.gmail.com >>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/payments-dev/CAKXHy%3De-AdXxo8CtZrSk-iPN05KmJ0_FWHOw5duyBXFGR58oGA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "blink-dev" group. 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