Even though this is not a typical OT, I don't think it should go beyond the current policy of 6 milestone before showing significant progress towards shipping. Would M109 to M114 (inclusive) be enough?
On Mon, Oct 31, 2022 at 3:36 PM Victor Tan <victor...@chromium.org> wrote: > Sorry for the unclear end milestone, we would like to experiment from M109 > to M115. > > Bests, > Victor > > On Mon, Oct 31, 2022 at 10:34 AM Yoav Weiss <yoavwe...@chromium.org> > wrote: > >> When do you expect the experiment to end? >> >> On Mon, Oct 31, 2022 at 3:32 PM Victor Tan <victor...@chromium.org> >> wrote: >> >>> We are expected to start in M109 Beta until 2023 Q2. We will document >>> more in the web blog post. >>> >>> Bests, >>> Victor >>> >>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2022 at 10:12 AM Yoav Weiss <yoavwe...@chromium.org> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> That's fair. What is the experiment's timeline? >>>> >>>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2022 at 3:09 PM Victor Tan <victor...@chromium.org> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> > How would the OT work for the Accept-Language values of the >>>>> very-first request sent to the origin? >>>>> As described in the implementation doc >>>>> <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RkPDf7DNtcOj4KXeW8wNCuYfto-drnGYST_NvZe3GoY/edit#bookmark=id.ob15kaq2dmkv>, >>>>> there are some limitations for the current OT architecture, we can't >>>>> validate the response OT token before we send the request. >>>>> For the very first request, we are still sending the full >>>>> Accept-Language user's list, after we validate the response, all >>>>> subsequent >>>>> requests start to send a reduced Accept-Language header. >>>>> >>>>> Bests, >>>>> Victor >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2022 at 8:18 AM Yoav Weiss <yoavwe...@chromium.org> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> How would the OT work for the Accept-Language values of the >>>>>> very-first request sent to the origin? Or are we expecting this request >>>>>> to >>>>>> send higher entropy, but not to hide potential breakage with later >>>>>> requests >>>>>> sending lower entropy? >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 7:57 PM Victor Tan <victor...@chromium.org> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact emails >>>>>>> >>>>>>> victor...@chromium.org, miketa...@chromium.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Explainer >>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://github.com/Tanych/accept-language >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Specification >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Variants header: >>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-httpbis-variants-06 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Summary >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We want to reduce the amount of information the Accept-Language >>>>>>> header exposes in HTTP requests and JS interface navigator.languages. >>>>>>> Instead of sending all user’s Accept-Language, we only send the user’s >>>>>>> most >>>>>>> preferred language after language negotiation in the Accept-Language >>>>>>> header. navigator.languages returns the same value as navigator.language >>>>>>> during this experiment. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We would like to run an origin trial for sites to opt into the >>>>>>> Reduce Accept-Language origin trial to proactively test for breakage. >>>>>>> See >>>>>>> below for more details. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Implementation Doc >>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RkPDf7DNtcOj4KXeW8wNCuYfto-drnGYST_NvZe3GoY >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Blink component >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Privacy>Fingerprinting >>>>>>> <https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/list?q=component:Privacy%3EFingerprinting> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Risks >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Interoperability and Compatibility >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The compatibility risk is low since we're planning to reduce the >>>>>>> amount of information in the Accept-Language header and >>>>>>> navigator.languages, rather than remove the header or change value >>>>>>> format >>>>>>> in the header. Most existing Accept-Language detection code should >>>>>>> continue >>>>>>> to work. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As for interoperability, no signal for other vendors. For >>>>>>> multilingual sites to rely on the Accept-Language header, developers >>>>>>> would >>>>>>> need to depend on a user's full Accept-Language list for some browsers >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> a primary user's Accept-Language for others. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Another signal is that the Chrome incognito model already reduced >>>>>>> the Accept-Language header and JS interface navigator.languages to one >>>>>>> language. The Accept-Language header can potentially expand to two if >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> first Accept-Language includes a region code, like en-US, the reduced >>>>>>> Accept-Language header will be en-US,en;q=0.9. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Experiment Summary >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The experiment is going to be a little different from a normal >>>>>>> Origin Trial. The goal is enabling developers to test and ensure >>>>>>> compatibility with our proposed changes. It’s incredibly important we >>>>>>> give >>>>>>> developers any chance to test systems at every level since this change >>>>>>> represents vast dependencies on the introduced headers. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As for enabling with the origin trial itself, there will be two >>>>>>> components controlled by the same origin trial: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> - >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Reducing the information in navigator.languages if the origin >>>>>>> trial enabled. >>>>>>> - >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The Accept-Language HTTP request header contains the user’s >>>>>>> primary preferred language, this can change if we detect a more >>>>>>> preferred >>>>>>> language during the language negotiation process. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Because of the experimental nature of reducing Accept-Language, a >>>>>>> valid origin token must be sent in the response header by origins which >>>>>>> opt-in the origin trial. Also two new headers Variants >>>>>>> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-httpbis-variants-06#section-2> >>>>>>> (indicating sites supporting languages) accept-language and >>>>>>> Content-Language <https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc3282> >>>>>>> need to be sent in the response header in order to make the language >>>>>>> negotiation to work correctly. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Please see the design and implementation document >>>>>>> <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RkPDf7DNtcOj4KXeW8wNCuYfto-drnGYST_NvZe3GoY/edit#heading=h.b6kmd248xsy4>for >>>>>>> more information. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Experiment Goals >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The goal of this origin trial is to enable developers to test how >>>>>>> reducing the Accept-Language request header and the JS getter >>>>>>> navigator.languages will affect their systems, especially to understand >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> user cases on navigator.languages. We hope this can provide sufficient >>>>>>> time >>>>>>> for developers to test. We can validate our current plans for reducing >>>>>>> Accept-Language and safely roll out them to the web based on their >>>>>>> feedback. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We will be relying heavily on user and developer feedback to >>>>>>> identify where breakage occurs, or where use cases are not accounted >>>>>>> for, >>>>>>> especially for multilingual sites depending on the Accept-Language >>>>>>> header, >>>>>>> and navigator.languages. We will create a GitHub repository and a >>>>>>> public >>>>>>> mailing list for gathering feedback. When the origin trial is ready, we >>>>>>> plan to publish developer guidance on how to enroll and provide >>>>>>> feedback. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Experiment Risks >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There are some risks, as many multilingual sites have come to rely >>>>>>> on the value in Accept-Language header and JS interfaces >>>>>>> navigator.languages to send the right representation pages to the user. >>>>>>> Site breakage can take many forms, both obvious and non-obvious. >>>>>>> However, >>>>>>> since sites are in control of the Origin-Trial, Variants and >>>>>>> Content-Language headers, a site can quickly opt out of the experiment >>>>>>> when >>>>>>> breakage is encountered. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Will this feature be supported on all six Blink platforms (Windows, >>>>>>> Mac, Linux, Chrome OS, Android, and Android WebView)? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No (All but WebView) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Is this feature fully tested by web-platform-tests >>>>>>> <https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/master/docs/testing/web_platform_tests.md> >>>>>>> ? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No (We fully test in browser_tests, WPT has limits to cover all the >>>>>>> test cases in Accept-Language header). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Flag name >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ReduceAcceptLanguageOriginTrial >>>>>>> Tracking bug >>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=1306905 >>>>>>> Launch bug >>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=1307484 >>>>>>> Link to entry on the Chrome Platform Status >>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://chromestatus.com/feature/5188040623390720 >>>>>>> <https://chromestatus.com/feature/5188040623390720#details> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to blink-dev+unsubscr...@chromium.org. >>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAJh4P7EvtPH_NQX_mJevEXu2fbePPQ7aYhfdBd%2BYB1J-5cn74g%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAJh4P7EvtPH_NQX_mJevEXu2fbePPQ7aYhfdBd%2BYB1J-5cn74g%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "blink-dev" group. 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