Hi Ben, thank you for your answer! I figured that the plan is to phase out support entirely, I was just wondering whether deprecating and removing WebSQL "in non-secure contexts" is going to affect chrome extensions (I assume it is not). Is there a specific timeline for removing WebSQL from the extensions and "secure contexts"?
I'm using WebSQL for a legacy reasons, I created my extension when WebSQL was a new thing in Chrome and I liked the fact that I was able to use a relational database. I was hesitant to stop using it because it was working well for my use case and seemed to be reliable for all these years. I'll have to explore all the available options and SQLite-over-Wasm looks great, although I might just try to migrate to chrome.storage or IndexedDB. Best, Michal On Wednesday, December 14, 2022 at 5:36:31 PM UTC+1 mo...@google.com wrote: > Our plan is to remove support entirely. > > It's good to hear from developers who have been using Web SQL - since the > vast majority of uses we've found on the web emanate from standard > libraries using it for browser sniffing or as a backup for basic key-value > storage. If you're using it, and migration to SQLite-over-Wasm looks hard > for you, I'd like to hear more about your use case. It's always difficult > when a feature you rely on gets removed - but we want to make this as easy > on everyone as possible. > > > On Wed, Dec 14, 2022 at 9:26 AM Michal Šimonfy <michal....@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Hello there! >> >> will WebSQL continue to be available in Chrome extensions (through the >> chrome-extension:// scheme)? >> >> Thank you! >> >> All the best, >> Michal >> >> On Tuesday, December 13, 2022 at 8:59:39 PM UTC+1 mo...@google.com wrote: >> >>> Hi Carl, >>> >>> I'm sorry we can't keep Web SQL going any further in its present form. >>> As you know, it's been deprecated for years and only Chromium still >>> supports it. It sees little use; almost any site that wants sophisticated >>> storage wants it to work on all browsers, and so people build things on top >>> of indexedDB. Despite the relatively small usage, it takes us time to keep >>> up with updates, and security problems demand our attention rather >>> frequently. We don't have enough engineers to merit keeping it going. >>> >>> On the other hand, we're quite excited about the new SQLite-over-Wasm, >>> and some developers of other databases have told us they're interested in >>> following this example. After years in which browser vendors tried to >>> create sophisticated storage solutions, often without success, the >>> possibility that databases that are available on other platforms might >>> become available on the web, created and supported by the developer >>> community, is quite exciting. >>> >>> Sorry that doesn't help with your HTML-file application :-/ If you're >>> curious, it is possible to embed Wasm in an HTML page: >>> >>> - >>> >>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/52582367/a-single-file-webassembly-html-demo >>> - https://gist.github.com/dio/ae79cf546e808a9bc46515bf9400ad5d >>> >>> Of course, this isn't as simple or as small as simply using Web SQL, but >>> it miiiiiight work? >>> >>> All best, >>> >>> Ben >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 11:06 AM Carl Turechek <carltu...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't think that the increased security will have an effect on my >>>> app, but the removal all together is my concern. Sorry if I haven't been >>>> clear enough. >>>> >>>> On Thursday, December 8, 2022 at 7:28:58 PM UTC-5 mo...@google.com >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Yes. Carl, does your app depend on Web SQL, webkitStorageInfo, or >>>>> something else? >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Dec 8, 2022 at 6:55 PM Carl Turechek <carltu...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> You'll break an app I developed to be passed around as a single html >>>>>> file. Hope you'll provide us plebs some guidance on finding a >>>>>> replacement >>>>>> solution. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 1:22:34 PM UTC-5 mo...@google.com >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I've done a more thorough search for examples of webkitStorageInfo >>>>>>> and of WebSQL in insecure contexts on the web. Among the top 10K sites, >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> only usage I found was from standard libraries - and, in these cases, >>>>>>> removal wouldn't cause an error or affect any functionality. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No one in Enterprise at Google, Microsoft, or Salesforce has >>>>>>> uncovered usage among their partners either. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 11:51 AM 'Thomas Steiner' via blink-dev < >>>>>>> blin...@chromium.org> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The developer-facing documentation is being updated in >>>>>>>> https://github.com/GoogleChrome/developer.chrome.com/pull/4299. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sat, Nov 12, 2022 at 12:26 AM Ayu Ishii <ay...@chromium.org> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We've done some extra communications with enterprise partners and >>>>>>>>> have come up with a new target milestone. >>>>>>>>> The new target milestone for this removal is M110, with enterprise >>>>>>>>> policy available for 2 milestones (M110-111). >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks! >>>>>>>>> Ayu >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 7:49:00 PM UTC-7 Ayu Ishii wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Thank you all for the approvals! >>>>>>>>>> And thank you miketaylr@ for the HTTPArchive analysis! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 1:12:55 PM UTC-7 Mike Taylor wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 6/1/22 3:52 PM, Yoav Weiss wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> LGTM3 >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 8:58 PM Mike Taylor <mike...@chromium.org> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/1/22 1:34 PM, Chris Harrelson wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 8:26 PM Ayu Ishii <ay...@chromium.org> >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Mike! >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> With the current usage measurements we see, we hadn't >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered any enterprise policy for opt-out. >>>>>>>>>>>>> But certainly can follow the process to do so if you feel that >>>>>>>>>>>>> there may be risk of undercounting. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Deprecation of WebSQL in third-party contexts added a policy >>>>>>>>>>>>> that lasted 3 milestones after deprecation before full removal as >>>>>>>>>>>>> an >>>>>>>>>>>>> example. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Although the usages were quite different from that >>>>>>>>>>>>> deprecation, we can follow the same process if this sounds >>>>>>>>>>>>> reasonable. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I think this plan sounds good. LGTM1 once you have an >>>>>>>>>>>> enterprise opt-out in place that will remain for 3 milestones. >>>>>>>>>>>> Also please >>>>>>>>>>>> make sure to communicate this change in the enterprise notes and >>>>>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>>>> communication channels. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> A couple of notes I took last Friday and forgot to post: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I dumped the list of sites from HTTPArchive (query below) and >>>>>>>>>>>> after de-duping them, ended up with 835 sites. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I then ran a script which naively looks at response codes, and >>>>>>>>>>>> got the following results: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> 2XX count: 685/835 >>>>>>>>>>>> 3XX to HTTP endpoint count: 74/835 >>>>>>>>>>>> 4XX count: 3/835 >>>>>>>>>>>> 5XX count: 2/835 >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> So, from this dataset, roughly 9% of those redirect to an HTTP >>>>>>>>>>>> endpoint. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> This should say HTTPS, not HTTP. I am bad at typing. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> That said, I think reducing risk of breakage for enterprise >>>>>>>>>>>> environments is a useful and friendly thing to do. LGTM2 w/ that >>>>>>>>>>>> done. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> SELECT >>>>>>>>>>>> rank, >>>>>>>>>>>> url, >>>>>>>>>>>> FROM >>>>>>>>>>>> `httparchive.blink_features.features` >>>>>>>>>>>> WHERE feature = 'OpenWebDatabaseInsecureContext' >>>>>>>>>>>> ORDER BY rank ASC >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> - Ayu >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:57:01 PM UTC-7 Mike West wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm happy to see this moving forward, thanks for pushing it >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ahead! >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> That said, this seems like the kind of thing that's >>>>>>>>>>>>>> likely-enough to impact enterprise that we should include a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> temporary >>>>>>>>>>>>>> opt-out to give ourselves some wiggle room if it turns out that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> we're >>>>>>>>>>>>>> undercounting usage. Have y'all already put something like that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> together? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -mike >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, May 27, 2022 at 2:18 AM Ayu Ishii <ay...@chromium.org> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Contact emails *ay...@chromium.org, jsb...@chromium.org, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ajayra...@google.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Specification *https://www.w3.org/TR/webdatabase/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Summary *We intend to deprecate and remove usage of WebSQL >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in non-secure contexts. Deprecation is targeted for M105 and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> removal is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> targeted for M107. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Blink component *Blink>Storage>WebSQL >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/list?q=component:Blink%3EStorage%3EWebSQL> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Motivation *The Web SQL Database standard was first >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposed in April 2009 and abandoned in November 2010. Gecko >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> implemented this feature and WebKit deprecated this feature >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2019 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://github.com/WebKit/WebKit/commit/761bce943c0696a6bb93116eb0576ed07dbfdc65>. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The W3C encouraged those needing web databases to adopt Web >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Storage <https://www.w3.org/TR/webstorage/> or Indexed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Database <https://www.w3.org/TR/IndexedDB/>. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WebSQL has been deprecated and removed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/g/blink-dev/c/TM6YDx1Hh08> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for third-party contexts in M97. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We hope to entirely deprecate and remove WebSQL at some >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> future point when usage is low enough. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *TAG review *N/A >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Risks >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Based on usage measurements >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://chromestatus.com/metrics/feature/timeline/popularity/4073> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rolled out in M97, 0.005% of page loads use WebSQL in a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> non-secure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> context. Less than 0.01% of top sites have adopted this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feature. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Out of the 20 top sites listed for the month of April 2022, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 11 of the sites use a feature detection library Modernizr >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1.5 <https://modernizr.com/news/modernizr-15>, on a version >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> released in 2010. This would create a test database to check >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feature >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> availability. I was unable to reproduce the creation of other >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WebSQL >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> databases outside of the one created by Modernizr on these >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sites. 4 sites >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that seem to use an outdated private mode detection script >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://stackoverflow.com/q/48169810> which was intended >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for older versions of iOS. All the scripts I have found checked >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> window.openDatabase existed before usage, likely due to the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lack of support >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Gecko and WebKit. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Interoperability and Compatibility >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gecko: Never implemented >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WebKit: Deprecation shipped in iOS 13 and Safari 13 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://trac.webkit.org/changeset/277564/webkit> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Web developers: No signals >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Debuggability *N/A >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Is this feature fully tested by web-platform-tests >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/main/docs/testing/web_platform_tests.md> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Not fully, one test >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:third_party/blink/web_tests/external/wpt/clear-site-data/support/test_utils.sub.js;l=136> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> checks the availability of the feature. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Tracking bug *https://crbug.com/1212492 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Link to related intents >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Intent to Deprecate and Remove: WebSQL in third-party >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contexts >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/g/blink-dev/c/TM6YDx1Hh08> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Link to entry on the Chrome Platform Status * >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://chromestatus.com/feature/5175124599767040 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from it, send an email to 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