----- Original Message ----- From: "David Hobby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Killer Bs Discussion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 9:55 PM Subject: America in the Middle East, was: Re: Seth Finkelstein on 16 words
> Dan Minette wrote: > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "David Hobby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > ... > > > No. We are dealing with a pathological minority, backed > > > up by a large sector of public opinion in the Middle East. If > > > we clean up our act, public opinion there will change. > > > > I'm in the middle and I have questions to ask of both sides of the > > arguement. Your's just happens to be the easiest to ask. What is the > > basis of this? What horrid things have we done in the Middle East. You > > mention supporting the Shah in the 50s. > > Yes. This is the argument that I want to be having. > I might lose it, but it will at least be more sensible. I'm > getting tired of having my words twisted on me. > So we're thinking that American misdeeds should be those > in the Arab world? That sounds fair--I imagine the average > Middle Easterner doesn't even know what we did in Chile, say. > (As the world gets more "global" this might change, and our > reputation in one area would have more of an effect on our > reputation in others.) It might, but if you look at the South American and Central American countries, most have some form of representative government. Compare an average South American country with an average Middle Eastern country. So, even with all the US meddling for the worse, there was enough US encouragement of the better so that the governments do a far better job serving the people in South America than they do in the middle east. > I mentioned the Shah because I believe that the Iranian > Theocracy came to power partially because of resentment to his > rule. But let me do some research... > > ---David > > > But, we facilitated the change of government when the Shah was deposed, > > about 25 years ago. > > (I wouldn't really call it that--we didn't seem to be doing > much "facilitating" at the time.) Huh? I remember a number of things that Jimmy Carter did to help the transistion along. He told the Shah that we would not tolerate massive killings to keep in power. We found a way out for him. Who knows, if he acted like Hussein, his son might still be in power. > Yes, and our "friends" the Saudis are some of the worst. > It might have made sense to uncritically ally with them during > the Cold War, but now it is time to insist on some changes there. How in the world could we insist? What would we do if they said no? _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
