Steve,
It comes down I can't agree this is great stuff without first hand knowledge. So yes I'll make a point to use it in the near future in a non life threatening application. Your description is a little more complete in this response or I read a little too quickly before. This time you said crimp this terminal, on then reflow it, and then seal it. That sounds a lot better than a solder and seal terminal. Do you know where I can find a copy of the Underwriter's Labs conditions of use? Phil Agur <http://www.catalina27.org/public_pages/profile270.htm> s/v Wing Tip Secretary, C270 LE #184 IC27/270A MMSI 366901790 www.catalina27.org <http://www.catalina27.org/> Vessel Doc# 1039809 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Port Huron Freecycle Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 1:22 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: catalina27-talk: Tool reccomendations Phil: While I might disagree with you about a soldered joint, there are crimp/solder/shrink tube terminals, where you do the crimp, then low melt solder, then shrink tube, all in one connector. I have used both types extensively, in many very wet environments (even under water, my bilge). I've never had one fail due to corrosion or wire pull out. I would not simply solder a joint, with nothing to protect it. During heating with these terminals, you can observe the solder run into the joint. When these terminals cool, they are fairly inflexible plastic. The hot melt cement firmly holds the wire after cure. Under high vibration, I would probably crimp, then shrink tube over. But even on battery cables, I've used "solder slugs", with shrink tube covers, and to remove them, they need to be cut off. The solder has completely permeated every strand. They will not fall off. No offense to any PhD's out there, but I'd never allow one near any of my power tools or torches. More over, I'd never let them do a physical repair on anything I own. I could show "Joe the Boater" how to bulletproof his wiring using these terminals. Not that they would stand up on the Space Shuttle, but for automotive or boating, they are a great, easy, waterproof connection. It's also easy to predict what happens when I give someone the right terminal, the right heating device, and the right knowledge. I'm am kind of confused by this, Phil: "This product actually looks like something worth noting for future use but I'm extremely well versed when it comes to wiring technology and will recognize when it can be used effectively." Okay..... I recognize that it's worth using now. I may be a rookie here, and a rookie skipper, but I'm not a rookie when it comes to maintaining, repairing or wiring. I've spent a long time in the MRO game. I don't remember telling you which one to use. I'm offering another viewpoint. It is a Forum, right? I can have input, true? Each one of us, from a rookie DYIer to someone "with 30+ years in Quality & Reliability well versed in doing failure analysis on a wide range of connection technologies in a metallurgical lab." need to decide what's best for OUR boat. You like crimp, I like solder/shrink tube. You say poTAYtoe, I say poTAHtoe. You say rum, I say "Hell, yeah!!". Each skipper should decide, no? In any event, I'll take rum and beer. Free always tastes better. Steve Bayless #3491 "Liebchen" Port Huron, MI On Tue, Nov 25, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Phil Agur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Steve, That's certainly a new product to me. It's made by a couple of real players and it's certified by a couple of agencies that test this type of product which is all good. What I don't like is that it involves a soldered connection. I can easily predict the results when I set someone up with the right stripper, the right crimp tool, and the right crimp terminal. That is usually not the case when it comes to a soldered connection. I firmly believe Murphy's Law was written about the simple solder joint, and history certainly bears that out. I recently let a couple of PHDs help out doing wiring on a group project. They know a great deal in their fields and they "knew how to solder" and yet we've already seen a half dozen solder joint or nicked wire failures in just 60 days. The audience on a list like this ranges from newcomers with no particular relevant technical background to someone with 30+ years in Quality & Reliability well versed in doing failure analysis on a wide range of connection technologies in a metallurgical lab. This product actually looks like something worth noting for future use but I'm extremely well versed when it comes to wiring technology and will recognize when it can be used effectively. Use it at the wrong time and it could easily obscure a cold solder joint from detection before it fails in use. I do love the adhesive lined shrink tubing seal portion of this device. This is great stuff and should be used regularly. It has been readily available on crimp style terminals for more than a decade and works great in a marine environment. I replaced all the crimps terminals going to my bilge pumps and bilge sensor about thirteen years ago and they are still going fine. Phil Agur <http://www.catalina27.org/public_pages/profile270.htm> s/v Wing Tip Secretary, C270 LE #184 IC27/270A MMSI 366901790 www.catalina27.org <http://www.catalina27.org/> Vessel Doc# 1039809 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Port Huron Freecycle Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2008 6:02 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: catalina27-talk: Tool reccomendations Another way to get a gas-tight crimp is by using self solder/shrink tube connectors. They are connectors that use a low temp solder. They are placed over the connection, then heated, preferably with a heat gun, but even a butane lighter in a pinch. This solders the wire, and shrinks the tubing around the wire, forming a complete seal. These can be used in very high moisture areas without failure. Not only do you have a nice tight complete connection, but you do not have to crimp in awkward or tough to access areas. There are even crimp/solder/shrink tube connectors for those who still want to make sure. They are all more expensive compared to regular crimp connectors, but I personally don't like to fix things twice. If anyone is interested, I can post a link or two on where to find them. I have scads of them from a previous job (I sold maintenance items, so I have all the toys), and they are very nice. Steve Bayless #3491 "Liebchen" Port Huron, MI -- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/porthuronfreecycle/
