It all depends on your take on the issue. As an orthodox Jew, I take the mitzvas as being divine in origin and follow them for that reason. Others look at them in a more logical view such as yours. They're time based or community based or separation based or health based or or or. When you've got a baby to feed for an hour in the morning, you can still pray before midday. Same for after midday and same for after evening. Judith takes care of a baby plus 2 older kids and still puts issues out and does a ton of other stuff. If a woman was bound by the same requirements then they could physically do it.
At 02:02 PM 4/8/02, you wrote: >Re: the positive, time-bound mitzvot - > >didn't a lot of these commandmants begin at a time and place where the roles >of men and women were quite different - men out tending the fields, and >women the home-makers? > >Women couldn't be bound to pray at certain times of the day when the baby >might need breast-feeding etc. at any hour. >(BTW my wife pointed this out when were were discussing this thread.) > >-Ben > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Beth F [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >> Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 8:44 AM >> To: CF-Community >> Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods >> >> >> Hm, the women have a choice in the role they play which is nice. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Judith Dinowitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 7:35 PM >> Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods >> >> >> > Women are not exempt from prayer -- just from prayer in a >> Minyan, which is >> > a positive, time-bound mitzvah (commandment). They are >> supposed to pray, >> > but are not obligated to do so at a specific time. >> > >> > Women are exempt from all positive, time-bound mitzvot. A positive >> mitzvah >> > is a commandment where you are doing something positive (as >> opposed to one >> > you accomplish by inaction, such as "Thou shalt not murder.") Some >> examples >> > include prayer, giving charity, having three meals on the Shabbos. A >> > time-bound mitzvah is one that must be done at a specific time. >> > >> > There are some exceptions to the exemption of positive, time-bound >> mitzvot, >> > including: >> > >> > 1. drinking four cups of wine at the Pesach seder >> > 2. lighting Chanukah candles >> > 3. all the mitzvot of Purim >> > >> > (These mitzvot are obligations because they involve >> commemorations of >> > special miracles in which women were included and, in some cases, >> > especially involved.) >> > >> > Why are women exempt from all positive, time-bound mitzvot? This has >> > certainly been used to attack Halachic Judaism, mainly from a >> > misunderstanding of the different roles of men and women creating an >> > "inequality". I will quote from Rav Yitzchak Yaakov Fuchs >> _Halichos Bas >> > Yisrael_, a two-volume set on Jewish laws as pertaining to >> women published >> > by Targum Press: >> > >> > "Many commentators offer reasons why the Torah exempts women from >> > time-bound mitzvoth. The Avudraham notes that it is the >> woman who assumes >> > responsibility for managing the household, attending to the >> physical needs >> > of the Jewish family, and playing a major role in rearing >> and educating >> > young children at home. Because many of these >> responsibilities must be >> > attended to at unpredictable times, the Torah exempts women from >> > obligations which must be performed at set times." >> > >> > Note: Women _MAY_ fulfill any mitzvoth from which they are >> halachically >> > exempt, except those specifically restricted to men. Once >> a woman takes >> on >> > a mitzvah on a regular basis, she is obligated to continue doing it. >> > >> > Also: There are positive mitzvot that are specifically >> given to women -- >> > the three I've always seen cited are the mitzvah of marital purity >> > (niddah), Challah (taking a portion of the challah you bake >> out for tithe >> > to the priest in the Temple), and candle-lighting for Shabbos. >> > >> > This is a hugely complex topic, and I could bring more >> information if >> > you've got questions. >> > >> > Judith >> > >> > >I'm going to leave the exact answer to that for Judith. My >> understanding >> > >is that they either have to or should pray during the day >> but are not >> > >required to do all that men have to (we're talking over an >> hour total a >> > >normal day for men). My understanding is probably not 100% >> correct as I'm >> > >not learned in what women must do prayer-wise. Luckily, I >> have a wife who >> > >IS learned in that. (she'll feel good with me praising her >> publicly and >> > >that's one of my jobs). >> > > >> > > >> > > > Really? >> > > > >> > > > So orthodox jewish women can pray but dont' have to? >> Except over >> food? >> > > > >> > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > > From: "Michael Dinowitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 6:41 PM >> > > > Subject: Re: Egypt: Land of the Gods >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > For Christians this is true but for Jews its >> different. Before the >> meal >> > > > there's a blessing on the food to be eaten and after >> there's thanks >> for >> > > what >> > > > was eaten and all. During holidays (and Shabbos) the >> meals are more >> formal >> > > > deals with a blessing over wine (or grape juice), then >> a washing of >> the >> > > > hands and a blessing over bread (or Matza during Pesach). This >> 'covers' the >> > > > meal, which is usually more than one course. Some fish, >> some soup, >> some >> > > > meat, etc. After the grace is said. During non-holiday >> eating a simple >> > > > blessing and grace is said based on what's being eaten. >> > > > > As a side note, the requirement to say a blessing >> before and after >> eating >> > > > is for all Jews regardless of gender. >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >my daughter 'serving' me with a small pitcher to >> wash my hands >> > > > > > before we said the grace after >meals. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > after meals? >> > > > > > forgive my ignorance, i thought grace was said before meals >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > ~~ >> > > > > > Stephenie >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > ______________________________________________________________________ Signup for the Fusion Authority news alert and keep up with the latest news in ColdFusion and related topics. http://www.fusionauthority.com/signup.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/cf-community@houseoffusion.com/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
