Also remember at the same time Reagan's representatives were meeting with the Iranians to get a deal through to not return the hostages until after the election. The same people were responsible for selling anti-air and ground to ground missiles to the Iranians, directly against US law.
On Wed, Feb 22, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Dana <dana.tier...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Hard to tell here what's a quote. But just wanted to say -- Carter's > competence depends on your definition. He was not a big-picture guy, I > would agree. And ironically, it was detail that causes the hostage > rescue to fail. I am not sure what Carter could have done to prevent > that, though. A sandstorm is a sandstorm no matter who is president. I > think that to some extent he gets a bad rap. The Reagan PR machine > needed him for contrast though. > > On Wed, Feb 22, 2012 at 10:12 AM, Jerry Barnes <critic...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> "Personally, I'd rate the Regan administration as way worse than the LBJ >> administration. LBJ had some decent accomplishments: Civil Rights Act, >> Medicare/Medicaid, Student Loan Program, FOIA. Regan had nothing equivalent. >> " >> >> So, you think the Great Society had a positive impact? >> >> There is certainly a sense of irony about the Civil Rights act since LBJ >> was so adamantly against it for the previous 20 years. It was a Republican >> ideal that he co-opted in order to garner votes and stay in power. Politics >> as normal. >> >> >> "This civil rights program about which you have heard so much is a farce >> and a sham--an effort to set up a police state in the guise of liberty. I >> am opposed to that program. I fought it in the Congress. It is the province >> of the state to run its own elections. I am opposed to the anti-lynching >> bill because the Federal Government has no business enacting a law against >> one kind of murder than another...(And) if a man can tell you who you must >> hire, he can tell you who not to employ. I have met this head on." - Lyndon >> B Johnson >> >> >> >> Anyway, the 1965 vote had more Republicans vote for it than Democrats even >> though they were a minority in congress. It wouldn't be hard to argue that >> it's not his legacy at all. It wouldn't be hard to argue that Nixon did >> more for civil rights than Johnson (though it may be for the same reason: >> to protect his position). He signed the voting rights amendment, equal >> opportunity legislation, and encouraged affirmative action. He even signed >> Title IX, even though he thought it might be the end of college sports (see >> Maryland University now for confirmation). >> >> >> "Obviously you have to balance those out against Vietnam and the debacle >> there." >> >> Compared to the destruction of the Soviet Bloc by Reagan (which may seem >> like a shame to some readers). >> >> >> "LBJ did a lot to strengthen the country but caused it a lot pain as well. >> His legacy in both areas continues to be felt today. " >> >> Yeah, the Immigration Act of 1965 that he signed is really being felt as >> illegals continue to overrun our country. >> >> Then there is the destruction, or at least erosion, of >> the traditional family unit, particularly in the Black community. But that >> is probably all good with the progressive folks, who resent a traditional >> family unit anyway. Here is some good info from Walter Williams about the >> "positive" impact of the Great Society on Blacks. >> >> Only 30 to 40 percent of black males graduate from high school. Many of >> those who do graduate emerge with reading and math skills of a white >> seventh- or eighth-grader. This is true in cities where a black is mayor, a >> black is superintendent of schools and the majority of principals and >> teachers are black. It's also true in cities where the per pupil education >> expenditures are among the highest in the nation. >> >> >> >> Across the U.S., black males represent up to 70 percent of prison >> populations. Are they in prison for crimes against whites? To the contrary, >> their victims are primarily other blacks. Department of Justice statistics >> for 2001 show that in nearly 80 percent of violent crimes against blacks, >> both the victim and the perpetrator were the same race. In other words, >> it's not Reaganites, Bush supporters, right-wing ideologues or the Klan >> causing blacks to live in fear of their lives and property and making their >> neighborhoods economic wastelands. >> >> >> >> Across the U.S., black males represent up to 70 percent of prison >> populations. Are they in prison for crimes against whites? To the contrary, >> their victims are primarily other blacks. Department of Justice statistics >> for 2001 show that in nearly 80 percent of violent crimes against blacks, >> both the victim and the perpetrator were the same race. In other words, >> it's not Reaganites, Bush supporters, right-wing ideologues or the Klan >> causing blacks to live in fear of their lives and property and making their >> neighborhoods economic wastelands. >> >> >> >> Or this great read from Thomas Sowell. >> >> August 20th marks the 40th anniversary of one of the major turning points >> in American social history. That was the date on which President Lyndon >> Johnson signed legislation creating his "War on Poverty" program in 1964. >> >> Never had there been such a comprehensive program to tackle poverty at its >> roots, to offer more opportunities to those starting out in life, to >> rehabilitate those who had fallen by the wayside, and to make dependent >> people self-supporting. Its intentions were the best. But we know what road >> is paved with good intentions. >> >> The War on Poverty represented the crowning triumph of the liberal vision >> of society -- and of government programs as the solution to social >> problems. The disastrous consequences that followed have made the word >> "liberal" so much of a political liability that today even candidates with >> long left-wing track records have evaded or denied that designation. >> >> In the liberal vision, slums bred crime. But brand-new government housing >> projects almost immediately became new centers of crime and quickly >> degenerated into new slums. Many of these projects later had to be >> demolished. Unfortunately, the assumptions behind those projects were not >> demolished, but live on in other disastrous programs, such as Section 8 >> housing. >> >> Rates of teenage pregnancy and venereal disease had been going down for >> years before the new 1960s attitudes toward sex spread rapidly through the >> schools, helped by War on Poverty money. These downward trends suddenly >> reversed and skyrocketed. >> >> The murder rate had also been going down, for decades, and in 1960 was just >> under half of what it had been in 1934. Then the new 1960s policies toward >> curing the "root causes" of crime and creating new "rights" for criminals >> began. Rates of violent crime, including murder, skyrocketed. >> >> The black family, which had survived centuries of slavery and >> discrimination, began rapidly disintegrating in the liberal welfare state >> that subsidized unwed pregnancy and changed welfare from an emergency >> rescue to a way of life. >> >> Government social programs such as the War on Poverty were considered a way >> to reduce urban riots. Such programs increased sharply during the 1960s. So >> did urban riots. Later, during the Reagan administration, which was >> denounced for not promoting social programs, there were far fewer urban >> riots. >> >> Neither the media nor most of our educational institutions question the >> assumptions behind the War on Poverty. Even conservatives often attribute >> much of the progress that has been made by lower-income people to these >> programs. >> >> For example, the usually insightful quarterly magazine City Journal says in >> its current issue: "Beginning in the mid-sixties, the condition of most >> black Americans improved markedly." >> >> That is completely false and misleading. >> >> The economic rise of blacks began decades earlier, before any of the >> legislation and policies that are credited with producing that rise. The >> continuation of the rise of blacks out of poverty did not -- repeat, did >> not -- accelerate during the 1960s. >> >> The poverty rate among black families fell from 87 percent in 1940 to 47 >> percent in 1960, during an era of virtually no major civil rights >> legislation or anti-poverty programs. It dropped another 17 percentage >> points during the decade of the 1960s and one percentage point during the >> 1970s, but this continuation of the previous trend was neither >> unprecedented nor something to be arbitrarily attributed to the programs >> like the War on Poverty. >> >> In various skilled trades, the incomes of blacks relative to whites more >> than doubled between 1936 and 1959 -- that is, before the magic 1960s >> decade when supposedly all progress began. The rise of blacks in >> professional and other high-level occupations was greater in the five years >> preceding the Civil Rights Act of 1964 than in the five years afterwards. >> >> While some good things did come out of the 1960s, as out of many other >> decades, so did major social disasters that continue to plague us today. >> Many of those disasters began quite clearly during the 1960s. >> >> >> This quote from Star Parker seems appropriate: >> >> Thirty-five years of Great Society social engineering have forced the >> disadvantaged to live under the control of the federal government. >> Politicians control their housing, their food supply, their schooling, >> their wages, and their transportation. A centralized government makes >> decisions about their childcare, healthcare, and retirement. It controls >> their reproduction through abortion and wants to control their deaths >> through euthanasia. - Star Parker >> >> >> and this one >> >> This was nothing less than a prescription for the utter destruction of >> traditional black families, and had it been proposed by the Imperial Wizard >> of the KKK such a program would have met with a quick and well-deserved >> fate. But embraced by liberal intellectuals and politicians, the war on >> poverty was the policy equivalent of smallpox on inner-city black families >> >> *A Patriots History of the United States*, pp. 68 >> >> >> Yes, that's a great legacy there. >> >> >> "Regan, there was no equivalent upside, in my opinion." >> >> Sure. It is opinion. I am glad you realize that and aren't proclaiming it >> as Gospel. >> >> What about Carter? There was no time elapsed between their two terms. >> >> I'll give Carter some props. I will say he was probably honest. >> Incompetent? Sure. But he was honest. >> >> >> J >> >> - >> >> "He hasn't got the depth of mind nor the breadth of vision to carry great >> responsibility... Johnson is superficial and opportunistic." Dwight >> Eisenhower on LBJ >> >> "He tells so many lies that he convinces himself after a while he's telling >> the truth. He just doesn't recognise truth or falsehood." Robert F Kennedy >> on LBJ >> "I never trust a man unless I've got his pecker in my pocket "- L >> >> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:347229 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/unsubscribe.cfm
