_____
From: Kevin Graeme [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 2:17 PM
To: CF-Community
Subject: Re: css, xhtml, standards, bandersnatch, etc...
I want to write to standards. Believe me. I'm the guy that chastises people
for not putting quotes around html attribute values even though
_most_browsers don't care.
But what's frustrating is knowing there is a "standard" out there that if I
use it means that users simply can't use my site. I can code to 100%
standards and have an unuseable site. How fucked is that?
Now of course, I can code to a subset of the standards. And that works, and
my code will validate 100%, but it also means I'm not really coding to 100%
standards. I'm coding to something like 70% standards, it's just that my
code all validates.
Grr.
So here's an example: centering a div with xhtml. <div align="center"> isn't
allowed. But the use of CSS to do a declared width and margin-right/left:
auto doesn't work in IE.
Grr.
And I notice that in your own CSS, you're using the voice and opera hacks.
-Kevin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sandy Clark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 1:00 PM
Subject: RE: css, xhtml, standards, bandersnatch, etc...
> While its frustrating that some of the items promoted in the standards are
> not in any browser, blame the browser makers, not the standards
> organizations.
>
> I'm a tyrant on this subject (ask my co-workers), but being able to write
> HTML and CSS that complies with some sort of standard, makes my life
easier.
> I'm not having to write a hack for every browser out there and having to
> re-write when a new browser comes on the market.
>
> If we all promote and use web standards, and use browsers which follow the
> standards, then there will be incentives for the browser makers to
implemnet
> the standards in their web sites. If we don't and use what's out there,
> then where is the incentive?
>
> _____
>
> From: Kevin Graeme [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 1:25 PM
> To: CF-Community
> Subject: css, xhtml, standards, bandersnatch, etc...
>
>
> So with the semi-OT talk of standards over on cf-talk, it coincides with
> something I've been thinking and some frustrations I've been having.
>
> Standards don't exist.
>
> They are a frumious Bandersnatch. We can write the words and they can even
> have some kind of meaning to people, but they either don't seem to have
the
> same meaning to everyone or they simply only exist as words and will never
> be seen in reality.
>
> Dave's quote was excellent and worth repeating I think:
>
> "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
> persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress
> depends on the unreasonable man." - George Bernard Shaw
>
> A current CSS frustration:
>
> display: table-column-group
>
> I really need that for a project I'm working on. I need the ability to
> control the display of a column in a table. Yes I can kludge around it,
but
> it's not pretty. So what browsers support this CSS2 declaration that was
> ratified over 5 years ago? None. It's a standard that doesn't exist. It's
my
> frumious Bandersnatch.
>
> -Kevin
>
> _____
>
>
>
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