Hi, Phil... I share your sentiments concerning CF and it's pricing and market share.
There's just no competing with "free"...and although I don't know .NET and C# at this point, I doubt seriously that a person equally experienced in .NET and C# would take substantially more time, if any at all, to maintain an app that was written in that language rather than CF. I love CF, and without any formal training other than a CF WACK 4.0 book, this list, and the Internet in general, have been able to write many web applications and make a decent living using CFML and CF Server. I'm a one-man development shop and don't have a corporate budget backing my purchases, so the cost of a technology definitely comes into play when I consider using it. I look at CF and Dreamweaver (I like WYSIWYG), and I think, hmmm....about $1700...I look at .NET and some of their free design tools, which are pretty good, and I think, hmmm...$0... I've only worked a little with .NET and MS's design tools and I have to say, I don't like having to learn a new language, etc., and find CF so much more intuitive. But I'm a smart guy and with some effort, I can learn .NET and C# and be just as productive in application production in the end. With the new tools, etc., that MS is providing to support .NET, it's getting harder and harder to justify spending so much money on CF. CF has no IDE, which adds to the cost of using CF, too. One of the biggest factors in my not embracing .NET yet...this list...I searched for a .NET list as good as CF-Talk, but couldn't find anything that came close. And I know just how important this list has been for me. Maybe it's because the CF community is smaller than the .Net community, but I haven't found a list to provide the support I would need to transition to .NET, yet. I'm still happily using CF 4.5.2, however, and see no reason to upgrade. I don't care how I code for the end user, be it in 4.5 style or the latest and greatest .cfc...all I care about is the experience for the end user...and unless I'm using FLEX or AJAX, I haven't seen any significant end user experience improvements through the various CF versions. A good discussion to have on a Friday... Rick -----Original Message----- From: Phillip Holmes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 10:30 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF vs. .NET presentations? Steve, Let me start by saying I have been with CF since 1996. I've recently learned .NET via C# as well. The resemblance of C# to Java is remarkable which made the learning curve much faster for me. However, I must agree with you and also add that ASP.NET 2.0 is faster / requires less hardware to host the same ap. It has built in enterprise session capability that allows your SQL database to track your session state and much more. After about 6 months of learning / using .NET, I don't see myself using ColdFusion as a recommended middleware for large scale sites or clients that are on a budget. The company that I work for HAD the highest traffic ColdFusion site on the planet. Here is a situation similar to mine: http://members.microsoft.com/CustomerEvidence/Common/FileOpen.aspx?FileName= 10625_ComputerJobs_bizversion_300k.wvx The thing that I don't agree with that CJ.com said was about the number of developers it took to maintain the sites pre / post conversion. They must have had some code org. issues, because that has been the same for us. Unfortunately, I can see the writing on the wall for CF unless Adobe adopts a DRAMATIC pricing reduction strategy. Plain and simply put, with .NET and Mono in the market, CF can no longer increase market share whilst continuing to maintain / increase their pricing. They're not the only game in town and they need to start acting like it. I pains me to write this publicly about CF. So please no flames. I hate it just as much as the next CF'er. However, I am relieved that I have finally learned .NET because the .NET to CF job ratio is about 100:1 at least. Holding on exclusively to a versus mentality will only hurt yourself in the end. --Phil ===========> -----Original Message----- From: Steve Brownlee [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 11:19 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: CF vs. .NET presentations? I use ASP.NET quite a bit, and while I'd still give CF a slight edge in development speed, the gap has closed tremendously since the days of original ASP. Now that ASP.NET has a top-notch visual designer, there are times when coding an ASP.NET application can be even faster than CF - given that the programmers knowledge of both is equal. Steve Brownlee http://www.fusioncube.net/ > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Kitta [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 5:57 AM > To: CF-Talk > Subject: RE: CF vs. .NET presentations? > > Is the argument that development in CF is quicker then in .NET still > valid - when comparing latest to latest - anyone expert on say Asp.Net > ... I just know VB myself, > > TK -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. 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