On Sat, Jan 29, 2011 at 10:24 PM, Paul Hastings wrote: > > On 1/29/2011 1:26 PM, denstar wrote: > >> Not /exactly/ infinitesimal, but it ain't no flood of newbs, neither. > > that sample size is more or less useless to base the rest of your arguments > on.
It was based on a percent. So I guess the real number would be 170 out of a 1000. I think. 17%? I suck at math. Still relatively useless, I reckon. It's all about perspective (or context?), even in math. Crazy as that sounds (I told ya I sucked at math). >> I don't know how much that has to do with the entrance of the open >> source engines as viable alternatives, but I feel it's factor. It was >> for me, anecdotal-y. > > technically i'd think that would actually be a "flight of fancy" seeing it's > based on a sample of one & taken as the sole factor in your shop staying w/cf. If the number had been 0, perhaps. I, however, am living proof of at least one, and unless the other folks were lying, there *are* more than I. The number of supported applications is a factor here too. I don't know if I'm an edge case, but I have lots of CFML powered crap. So long as it stays CFML, there's /at least the potential/ that ACF will once again be the engine powering said crap. If I switch to PHP, there is, IMHO, markedly less of a chance for Adobe to ever be the engine powering my crap. And let us not forget that a lot of pointy-headed-bosses *love* big corps like Adobe. Makes 'em feel warm fuzzies (even if the paid support is generally a lot more expensive and a lot less helpful). >> I attribute some of that to CFers realizing the *awesome* power of >> open source, but again, I think the engine alternatives have gone a >> long way towards helping as well. > > pretty much all my i18n stuff has been OS long before either BD or railo, has > nothing whatsoever to do w/either. so in your anecdote based way of thinking, > you are proven wrong ;-) OMG! Proof! ;-) I still wouldn't mind seeing the figures. Anecdotal-ish-ly, it seems like the number of OSS projects has "exploded" over the last couple years. >> CFML devs are no longer beholden to some commercial entity's >> well-being, which adds a *huge* bit of stability to the language that >> was just plain *not there* prior. > > seriously? Deadly seriously. =) Do most companies donate the source code to their users when they go out of business, in your experience? >> I don't know about "top". Unless the "target" is the existing >> "static" community, which would seem a rather backwards plan, IMHO. > > adobe, like any product producer, has to maintain it's base customers. railo's > not producing much (if any) new cf customers but is instead cannibalizing the I guess it's all relative. And maybe that 17% is a lie. Nobody likes free good stuff. ;)p > existing market. it doesn't follow that adobe will be blowing sweet sweet > kisses > at railo. It's not about Adobe and Railo having a love-in and making babies (& FWIW, it's us devs bringing the drama). My point was, that not only would Adobe's base have shrunk, but the "CFML" base would have shrunk as well, had I "left". If you only care about Adobe making money, then there is no real difference between the two. However, if you care about your fellow CFML coders putting food on the table, so to speak, then there is a pretty big difference between the two. >> It doesn't need to be contentious. Friendly competition is where it's at, >> yo. > > but you know that "friendly competition" is not true, even if you say don't > care > what railo's ultimate plan is. it doesn't seem "friendly" to me or will it > seem > very friendly to their existing customers if they do indeed succeed with > their plan. > I guess I'm just coming from a different perspective. I think that friendly competition is "true", and can be one of the bestest forces for furtherance around. Open Source Software is a powerful, driving force in today's software world. That is no conspiracy, that's just math (although the boring way math is portrayed may itself be a conspiracy- but I digress). I am amazingly super happy that there are open source alternatives for CFML these days. I think it's tits for us developers, and tits for the language in general (a pair of tits, if you will). Perhaps I don't have my priorities in order. I would not be surprised one whit. I'm happy though, so, eh- screw it. To each their own! :Den -- I have resolved on an enterprise that has no precedent and will have no imitator. I want to set before my fellow human beings a man in every way true to nature; and that man will be myself. Jean-Jacques Rouss ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341705 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm
