As far as backnumbers of the thread are concerned,  the first post I saw was Ian Clark's
reply to Greg Heil's unseen (by me) message.

Mike


On 14/12/2019 03:12, 'Jim Russell' via Chat wrote:
Can't follow (or find any earlier older parts of) this thread, but if it 
suggests
that someone is looking to update j for IOS I can't help but to cheer on that 
effort!

On Dec 13, 2019, at 5:52 PM, greg heil <[email protected]> wrote:


i am sure Apple would not characterize themselves as Nazi's, nor did i mean to 
characterize them as such ... however as the saying goes "the road to Hell is paved 
with good intentions".
i am sure they have "good intentions" for their own bottom line and the 
"happiness" of their customers. That currently seems to involve modifying how they 
interact with App Store Developers, and the copyrights those devs include in their submissions. 
They are a giant and can certainly affect the marketplace, which they hope to do, to achieve the 
above benefits... but not necessarily the health or the freedom of the rest of the ecology - which 
Iverson Software, and Developers in general, inhabit.
By necessity the rest of the world must adapt (no matter which way Apple 
swings), hopefully towards a win-win scenario, but not necessarily.
~greg
http://krsnadas.org

--

from: Raul Miller <[email protected]>
to: Chat forum <[email protected]>
date: Dec 13, 2019, 8:44 AM
subject: Re: [Jchat] [Jsource] building jsource in Xcode for iOS platform

Quoting:

from: Ian Clark <[email protected]>
to: Chat forum <[email protected]>
date: Dec 12, 2019, 8:28 PM
subject: Re: [Jchat] [Jsource] building jsource in Xcode for iOS platform

who Quoted:

from: greg heil <[email protected]>
to: Source forum <[email protected]>
date: Dec 12, 2019, 1:04 PM
subject: Re: [Jsource] building jsource in Xcode for iOS platform

where it was said:

It seems Apple is now on the warpath against ALL GPL'd code  ...(the 
presumption is they do not like the viral nature) …
IMHO it's not Apple being nazi. It's forced on them.
Given that Apple is a very large collection of people, I think that this is not a 
meaningful distinction. Or: it's only "forced on them" if we ignore their past 
decisions leading them to this point.
App Store sells products developed by 3rd parties, under contract governed by the usual commercial 
agreements to protect IPR, e.g. non-disclosure. It follows that "Open Source" and 
"App Store product" are a contradiction in terms.
Not at all.
But that doesn't keep people from making that kind of assertion. But the people doing so, 
as a general rule, have not read copyright law, have not read "open source" 
licenses, etc.
But Apple has always based its business on offering (I don't say 
"guaranteeing") some sort of security with its premium-priced products. But 
more and more they're being asked to deliver. They can only do this – and only with their 
newer products, like iOS and Catalina – if they stop your machine *ever* running *any* 
code that has not been downloaded *without modification* from App Store.
This is much closer to relevant and accurate.
But it's still only a part of the picture.
How are they going to do this without stifling independent development? This 
must be really taxing their best minds.
There's a variety of possibilities here, but... anyways...
Think of a nation state trying to prevent their children (read: "citizens") 
seeing bad stuff on the worldwide web. I discern 3 approaches: 1. The Iranian approach. 
Pull the plug and stick the whole country in purdah.
Isn't that currently more of a fear and an intermittent issue than a long term 
issue?
2. The USA/UK approach. Heavy bureaucracy that's mainly for show. All fur coat 
and no knickers.
That's ... not really accurate. It's more that most people don't understand the 
goals of the various bureaucracies, even while heavily relying on their people 
doing their jobs.
3. The Chinese approach. Iron hand in velvet glove. Needs bold PR.
Again, that's not completely accurate. But the place is huge, and also I have 
less information about those systems.
Apple, I'd say, is trying to stay with approach 3ns. But 2 and 1 are creeping 
in, as panic measures.
I'd characterize Apple's situation as: they're currently in a pendulum swing towards 
being more of a style-based outfit. But, yes, most of their manufacturing is in China 
because lobbying has made manufacturing here unsustainable. And, as a result, they're 
experiencing a lot of pressure to move away from the "substance" side of 
technology.
Thanks,
Raul
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