To play devil's advocate a bit, at least in the design area, having
the greatest of certifications, unless you have a resume showing real
experience, will NOT get you a job in building large and complex
networks.
It could be a useful exercise to articulate the sort of
responsibilities for which a given certification will prepare you.
Cisco, frankly, should be doing this far more specifically than they
do. While I always despair of Cisco taking any useful comment from
this list, such definitions could at least be suggested to them.
Let me try an analogy. CID, ostensibly the pinnacle of design
information, teaches design principles for small to medium networks.
Since its inception, there's been a constant cutback in the critical
skills of determining requirements, partially driven by a desire to
showcase products. This is most evident in the Stratacom material
taking up perhaps 5-10% of the course, time that could have been
spent in problem analysis, yet not remotely going into the design
principles of a WAN switched network. I could (and have) taken many
subjects that CID discusses in a couple of hours (e.g., addressing,
OSPF, BGP if it were even discussed, fault-tolerant load-shared
switching, and discuss them at useful length for 2 to 5 days).
The key thing to understand is what a certification would do for you.
I can't imagine that having a CCIE Design would have any useful
effect on my ability to get new jobs, but, on the other hand, I can
point to a resume of around 30 years of progressively responsible
results. My work isn't limited to Cisco alone.
So alternative ways of demonstrating advanced design experience
include participating in the IETF, writing books and articles, etc.
All to be considered in your career planning.
>Hi Mark, hi all,
>
>I totally agree with you. I am currently a CCDP and as a pre-sales engineer,
>I do not have the opportunity to maintain the equipment.
>Some of the questions of the CCDP track were already sometimes painful for
>me (like which show command to use), although I find a command is the best
>summary of 2 pages theory, and I agree commands must be part of the exams.
>I would like to upgrade my skills to CCIE (now that CCDP has been degraded,
>one year ago it was the highest cert for design), but as I understand CCIE
>lab is really 'speed' of config and troubleshooting.
>I don't see how I can prepare that on top of my normal job responsabilities,
>and there's even no way my company would build a lab with that equipement.
>It's only at cisco that they could afford to dedicate all this equipment to
>a lab.
>Now CCIE lab design has been retired for some time... I guess it will be
>hard for them to find candidates in other companies that Cisco!!
>
>Rgds
>Laurent
>
>
>>From: "Mark Holloway" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>Reply-To: "Mark Holloway" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>Subject: CCIE Design...too much?
>>Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 07:24:14 -0800
>>
>>Looking at Cisco's requirements for all of their CCIE tracks, it looks like
>>the CCIE Design Lab requires "the candidate to configure all of the devices
>>included in the design."
>>
>>So not only do you design that proposed network, you must configure it too.
>>For those of use who work in the pre-sales engineering field where the CCDA
>>and CCDP made the most sense, I think this is going a little too steep for
>>CCIE Design. I'm not opposed to learning how to configure equipment, but
>>the list of equipment is literally impossible to build a home lab (Catalyst
>>6500, 3500, 2900, PIX, Local Director, 7500, 7200, 4700, 3600, 2600, 2500,
>>7830 Call Manager, and more). This is double the R/S Exam. Is it really
>>realistic to expect someone who designs networks (as opposed to
>>administering/troubleshooting) to know all of this? I'm assuming the
>>required knowledge of this technology needs to be top-notch, like with the
>>other CCIE exams.
>>
>>I always felt the design path was more geared toward pre-deployment and not
>>post. Of course, some knowledge of the hands on is good, but in my job
> >today I may sit with a client or a Data Engineer and go over some configs,
>>but I don't maintain the equipment.
>>
>>Just my .02! Opinion appreciated..
>>
>>Regards,
>>Mark
>>
>>
>>
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