I think the old saying from college was: When you get your B.S you think you know everything. When you get your M.S. you know you know everything. When you get your Ph.D you realize you know nothing. Jim "John Neiberger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... > I think a person's attitude regarding this situation depends entirely on > their experience. For me, I began in this field a little over two years > ago. Starting from scratch, not even knowing what a router was, I looked up > to the CCNA certification as something fairly lofty. All I did for months > was study until my head hurt, and then I'd study some more. I also was > getting daily hands-on experience at work doing very basic stuff and my > employer sent me to a few classes that helped out greatly. One of the > biggest helps was discovering this list! <g> > > By the time I got around to taking the test, it was far easier than I > expected. This was my first Cisco test and I discovered that for a great > number of questions, one did not need to know the answer, but you simply had > to have decent reasoning skills. For me, I had reached a new plateau and I > was totally psyched about it. At this point I thought I might never be able > to grasp even CCNP-level concepts, as I was just really getting a hold on > material at my current level. I wasn't content, yet I was glad that I had > reached one of my first major goals. > > It was later, while still a CCNA, that I would interact from time to time > with other CCNA-level people who had not had the benefit of employer-paid > classes and hands-on experience. Because I tend to be egocentric and expect > everyone to be like me <g> I would sometimes be surprised that they could > not answer what I thought was a simple question. I began to be concerned > that the CCNA was really too easy, not remembering how hard I had studied > for months. That was easy?? It was pretty dang hard at the time! > > My concerns grew when I would interact with CCNP-level people who also could > not answer questions that I thought they should have known the answers to. > Now I was worried that CCNP was too easy and I hadn't even gotten there yet! > It seemed pretty hard to me at the time and it took me longer to get it than > I originally expected. > > After finally reaching CCNP and then CCDP, I wasn't as excited as I was > about getting CCNA. I think at this point, the further we progress the more > we realize how much we don't know, especially when faced with the daunting > CCIE written and lab. > > In hindsight, it should be noted that the certification does not make the > person. There are CCNA-level people out there who are far more advanced > than I, and there are CCNPs out there who can't troubleshoot their way out > of a paper sack. I find that this is largely dependent on personal work > experience. A CCNA with four years experience in a production environment > is probably going to be more advanced than a CCNP with two years under his > belt. > > When expecting a certain level of knowledge, we should look at both > certifications as well as the actual experience of the person in question. > > Okay, with all of that said, I must agree in part with the original poster. > It does concern me sometimes when a CCNP-level person doesn't seem to > understand a basic CCNA-level concept. I think this is because I'm worried > that since I'm also a CCNP, someone might encounter this person and assume > that the CCNP certification must not mean very much if they don't understand > even basic concepts. > > In the end, though, I don't know if really matters that much. > Certifications should never be the final arbiter of a persons abilities. If > that were the case, our resumes would be a lot shorter and interviews would > be unnecessary. All I can do is strive to make myself a better example of a > CCNP (or whatever) and not worry as much about others. > > When studying martial arts I learned to stop comparing my progress with the > progress of others. Their progress was irrelevant to mine. As long as I > kept studying and could say that today I am better than I was yesterday, all > would be well. > > I think that applies here, too. > > Thanks for reading my rambling > John the Wordy > > > JUst because u think they dont know nothing, they really dont know > nothing > > . Can u post your grades here so that well see how smart u are? If u > think > > that you know more than people who are getting CCXX certified then why > > dont u hurry up and take the lab. Dont u think that these people should > be > > credited for what they have achieved. Cisco is not mystery anymore. > More > > and more people will try to learn it. More and more people will produce > > learning aides, materials that will enables guys to learn as easily as > > possible. These guys dont have to worry about your opinions after they > > passed these exams. These guys may even passed the lab before you do. > And > > maybe you will come here complaining that Cisco made the lab so easy. > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Mike Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Date: Sunday, March 18, 2001 2:54 AM > > Subject: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX > > > > > > >I will probably get yelled at for this one but... > > > > > >I am a CCNA, CCDA, CCNP, and yes going after the CCIE. > > >So up front I am not against certs. > > > > > >I am becoming aware of more and more people becoming > > >Cisco certified and not know enough to go and actually > > >do the work. Our company has and is interviewing for > > >network folks, I have the opportunity to interview > > >these people to verify technical experience. I have > > >had CCNA, CCNP, and yes even CCIE written folks who > > >could not tell me what they 'should' acutally know. > > > > > > > > >This scares me because I am also working hard toward > > >my certs and the CCIE. But it has been proven and is > > >showing up more that these people are becoming "paper" > > >Cisco folks, as in the paper MCSE. > > > > > >I know and hope the CCIE LAB and title will remain as > > >difficult if not more so in the future. I for one do > > >not want to spend a year of my life gaining the CCIE > > >title to be one among thousands who also have it. > > > > > >That is my insite and hope Cisco will > > >try to make it more difficult to obtain the CCNP/DP > > >and not become another MCSE program. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >__________________________________________________ > > >Do You Yahoo!? > > >Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > > >http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ > > > > > >_________________________________ > > >FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html > > >Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > _________________________________ > > FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html > > Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > _______________________________________________________ > Send a cool gift with your E-Card > http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/ > > > _________________________________ > FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html > Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > _________________________________ FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
