"That's the point. You are taking about a bunch of wrappers. They are not bad, but will not make these people to move their asses from java. Even if they can introduce clojure in their tools set."
That's utter bogus. Who has ever said that..."I won't move to Clojure because I can do it in Java". Because Clojure has a terse syntax, and sane defaults, most Clojure code will be 1/10th the size. Smaller code often means less bugs, etc. But a bunch of wrappers? Don't be ridiculous. Go look at test-check, core.async, core.logic, Datomic, ring, compojure. None of that stuff is a wrapper. But I guess what irritates me the most about comments like this is that they completely miss the goal of software engineering. The goal is to engineer a solution to a problem. If people are just taking whatever stuff Oracle/Microsoft/Google/Cognitect/Clojurewerkz/TypeSafe hands them and saying "welp...I guess we'll use X because that's what the big boys use." Then they're a lost cause IMO. Software engineering and design is about thinking about the problem and coming up with simple solutions. It's design, not an assembly plant. Timothy On Sat, Apr 19, 2014 at 3:26 PM, Paulo Suzart <paulosuz...@gmail.com> wrote: > Yes. > > That's the point. You are taking about a bunch of wrappers. They are not > bad, but will not make these people to move their asses from java. Even if > they can introduce clojure in their tools set. > > Thanks > On 19 Apr 2014 18:09, "Timothy Baldridge" <tbaldri...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> " I have dozen colleagues that can't foster clojure because they want a >> language with tools that fits every day." >> >> Can you explain this statement? I'm not sure I understand. I haven't >> touched any language but Clojure for "every day work" in months (years?). I >> can write a game in Clojure, I can write swing/javafx apps if I want, I can >> write webapps, I can write distributed systems, I can write high >> performance code as well as "hack it out fast" code. >> >> So far in my career as a software developer, I've learned, C, C++, >> QBasic, VB, Delphi, Python, C#, Python, and Erlang. I left every single one >> of those languages because at one point or another they restricted what I >> could do with them. There came a day where I said "wow...if I could just do >> X this would be so much simpler". That day hasn't come yet for me with >> Clojure. Even after 4 years. >> >> I'm not sure what these people want? >> >> Timothy >> >> >> On Sat, Apr 19, 2014 at 3:00 PM, Paulo Suzart <paulosuz...@gmail.com>wrote: >> >>> Unfortunately I'm not a Stuart or a Emerick, or a Miller. So I can't >>> really contribute to clojure that deep. I'm in the user /tech consumer >>> side. >>> >>> That said, it is not my concern only. I have dozen colleagues that can't >>> foster clojure because they want a language with tools that fits every day. >>> Not tools for very specific cases that may come out if they work in a very >>> specific company in a very specific country. >>> >>> I don't know, I still have all my coins on that. Really hope we can have >>> almost pure clojure clojure solutions as we have pure java solutions. >>> >>> Thank you all for your opinions. >>> On 19 Apr 2014 17:40, "Michael Klishin" <michael.s.klis...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> 2014-04-19 20:15 GMT+04:00 Paulo Suzart <paulosuz...@gmail.com>: >>>> >>>>> People say clojure is good for data. But where are the cases? And more >>>>> specifically, where are the frameworks and libs to support it? Are they >>>>> talking about wrappers around java for Hadoop? Sigh... >>>> >>>> >>>> I see lots of companies of all sizes use Clojure successfully for data >>>> processing. The great thing about data >>>> processing is that there are many ways to do it. Some use Cascalog, >>>> some use libraries unrelated to Hadoop, >>>> others use just Clojure. So while there may or may not be a single >>>> "killer app" like Rails, Clojure is fantastic >>>> at this particular group of problems, as demonstrated by companies from >>>> < 10 to 10s of thousands of people. >>>> -- >>>> MK >>>> >>>> http://github.com/michaelklishin >>>> http://twitter.com/michaelklishin >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Clojure" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com >>>> Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with >>>> your first post. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en >>>> --- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Clojure" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Clojure" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com >>> Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with >>> your first post. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Clojure" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> “One of the main causes of the fall of the Roman Empire was that–lacking >> zero–they had no way to indicate successful termination of their C >> programs.” >> (Robert Firth) >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "Clojure" group. >> To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com >> Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with >> your first post. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Clojure" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Clojure" group. > To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com > Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with > your first post. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Clojure" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- “One of the main causes of the fall of the Roman Empire was that–lacking zero–they had no way to indicate successful termination of their C programs.” (Robert Firth) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Clojure" group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Clojure" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
