Hi Josh, Great explanation, thank you! All your recollections are correct. Only, I'm currently boatless... I have virtually no experience with diesel engines hence, my ignorant questions...LOL So, your (and all others) insights and comments are very well received and appreciated! Still searching,Danny
---------- Original Message ---------- From: Josh Muckley <muckl...@gmail.com> To: DJ Hawk <djhaug...@juno.com>, "C&C List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 37+ engine size Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2015 10:45:36 -0500 When you are experiencing heavy currents and can only go 3 kts to round the mark.� Is that 3 kts being measured by the gps or is it 3 kts measured by the speed log?� It sounds to me like it is 3kts by gps and if so then from all of the other listers comments and my own experience a larger engine would only allow you to proceed at 4kts. When people experience a mismatch between boat size and drive train performance it is most often experienced in heavy chop.� I believe there are two main factors at work in these "under powered" cases.� The first is the diameter of the prop.� Smaller engines = smaller props = less bite in the water and when things get sloppy the prop slips and cavitates more. The second part is prop speed.� In order to use a smaller engine to do the same job the designers will gear it to gain mechanical advantage.� The prop will have to spin faster than its higher powered counterparts.� Faster prop=less bite and closer to cavitation. When these two factors are at play the speed log will slow disproportionately to the gps speed.� Everyone has probably experienced plunging the bow into a breaker and seeing the boat speed come down.� The question is how long does it take go recover.� These smaller props spinning at higher rpm slip and cavitate more so speed recovery is longer.� If the next breaker gets to you before the speed recovers.... Remind me, your boat, Lolita?, has an A4 right?� Is it direct drive?� If my recollections are correct then you have a couple of things that set your experiences apart from what you could expect from a larger diesel powered boat such as a 37+, 38LF, or a 40.� Forgive me if my recollections are incorrect. First is that the gas engines don't have as much low end torque so when those breakers come and the boat needs to make up, the engine has a harder time coming back up to speed.� Second, the direct drive (1:1) means that right from the start the prop has to spin much faster and an increase in load at the prop is directly felt as an increase in load at the engine.� There are no gears to help in having less low end torque so the prop pitch is much less as well, again meaning more cavitation. Third, being a shorter and lighter boat means that the breakers will cause the boat to hobby-horse around a lot more and also push the bow off requiring more helm. All of these factors make for a less comfortable ride and slower progress in the thick stuff. Good Luck, Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Jan 12, 2015 7:10 AM, "Danny Haughey via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: I think my point is; Where we sail there are some pretty good currents and the chop picks up quite often.� Sometimes, you have to make it home heading into both.� That's when you want the extra hp.� We sometimes have guests that get a little nervous when the conditions get exciting and we try to get them in as quickly as possible.� Sure, you can move along at hull speed in favorable conditions but, the only time I'd be able to notice that the stern dug in a few inches would be in the harbour, sometimes.� We almost never experience flat water and are typically dealing with a 3 to 4 knot current.� Sometimes it is our favor and usually try to time our trips so it is.� But day sailing, I don't really care as much.� I sometimes could only get 3 knots under full power trying to round a mark to get into a harbour.� That can be a little unnerving. � Danny From my Android phone -------- Original message -------- From: Chuck S <cscheaf...@comcast.net> Date: 01/11/2015 11:45 PM (GMT-05:00) To: Danny Haughey <djhaug...@juno.com>,"CNC boat owners, cnc-list" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 37+ engine size ". . . bigger is better. . . "?� Is a bigger booty better?� Will a bigger anchor make my sailboat go faster?�What helps sailing is "no engine".�� Light means flight.�Research the brochures and look to buy a boat with the "designed right size engine", not bigger.� An upgrade would be a smaller diesel w a turbo.� Just sayin. Chuck From: "Danny Haughey via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2015 7:54:45 AM Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 37+ engine size Ok well, I guess it is adequate then.� I just tend to see 40 hp engines in most 40 footers. Maybe not be the ideal and will be a bargaining point if it comes to that. Bigger is better in this instance I think... Thanks for the insights guys! Danny From my Android phone -------- Original message -------- From: allen via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Date: 01/10/2015 3:53 PM (GMT-05:00) To: Robert Abbott <robertabb...@eastlink.ca>,cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 37+ engine size Our 30-2 has 20 hp Universal and easily reaches hull speed in light to calm conditions.� Originally it was powered by an 18 hp Universal that netted 16.�Allen Miless/v Septima From: Robert Abbott via CnC-ListSent: Saturday, January 10, 2015 3:41 PMTo: Danny Haughey ; cnc-list@cnc-list.comSubject: Re: Stus-List C&C 37+ engine size Danny: Some say if you have one hp per foot of boat, you are adequately powered for a sailboat.� A 35 hp diesel in a 37+ seems adequate to me. Rob Abbott AZURA C&C 32 - 84 Halifax, N.S. On 2015/01/10 12:30 PM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List wrote:Hi Guys,�I'm eyeing a 1989 37+ �but it has a 35 HP universal diesel. �That, seems kind of small for a nearly 40' boat. �doesn't it?�Danny _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album. Please donate to the C&C Photo Album to keep this list free for all subscribers. Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album. Please donate to the C&C Photo Album to keep this list free for all subscribers. Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album. 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