--- In [email protected], <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The problem for me is that I have to work: > it's true that Delphi/FPC/Lazarus have compact Win32 > executables: unfortunately paying clients do not care > about such things. Speed and compactness are often relative: > Delphi is too expensive, has a small user base (in Italy) and > could disappear at any moment; > Lazarus frankly is not yet up to the clients' requirements: > I am afraid it will do the same as Delphi: leave me 'up > the creek without a paddle';
I'm afraid I have to agree...the customers care little for compact executables - they want support, and the assurance that they'll find the necessary resources to maintain existing applications/codebase. Unfortunately, Delphi has neither. > > The clients, be they software developers or the end users, > often want DotNet/Web applications so the bloaty frameworks > are fine: most computers with 1Gb of RAM and a disk of 200GB > wouldn't notice if such a framework is present and the speed of the > user interface is usually more than fast enough: very often it is the speed > of the > database server or the Internet connection to the Web server that is the > real determining factor; even interpreted script code is often very > fast on a modern computer; > the bloaty frameworks are from now on > usually part of the operating system in any case: their advantage is that > they are standardised and progressively maintained and should provide > standard system wide library routines with thousands of users; Again, you are on the money. Either Java/JVM or .NET is the framework of choice - in some cases, both are used extensively (such as my current client). The days of the desktop are definitely numbered. (see next point) > > The future of programming will very likely be using Web interfaces > and Web services: even recent industrial multiuser interfaces > are often Intranet Web browser GUI's: these are not as easy to > develop in Win32 as they are in DotNet/AspNet, even > if the latter are 'bloated'; Two words: distributed programming. That is the future, and it is here now. My current client has hundreds of servers, and thousands of users: the browser is the GUI. Web services and stateless, web- based applications are the norm. Java and .NET/ASP ARE the development platforms of choice. > > If clients are interested in multiplatform applications, they often go for > Java > which has a HUGE user base which has been integrated into > the professional working scene for years: I haven't seen a single job offer > for non Delphi Pascal in Italy in the last eight months. Multiplatform very often means Windows & Unix/Linux. The skill set most in demand today (for Windows) is .NET (C#/VB.NET/ASP), and for Unix/Linux is Java (with some Perl). That is the bottom line...Pascal? Good luck finding clients. Even C/C++ coders are hard-pressed to find as much work. > > I agree that Delphi is perhaps the best tool for developing Win32, > unfortunately that is not in line with the main market demand: > its not possible to 'insist' on Pascal; Unfortunately, true. The last shop where I proposed Pascal, the effort was very short-lived, and gave way to Java - Perl/CGI. Delphi is a great tool for stand-alone Win32 apps...that's the extent of it. As a viable tool/IDE for distributed programming it falls short. To achieve functional parity with Java/.Net (which are distributed capable "out of the box") you have to invest substantially in 3rd-party tools. Why bother? Customers no longer are willing to invest heavily in a product that has "no visible means of support"; not to mention a lack of available resources (i.e. developers). It is sad, but I've relegated Delphi to my shelf of "forgotten" tools - i.e. those that have been eclipsed by more in- demand offerings. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Micha³ Wo¼niak" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 8:01 PM > Subject: Re: [delphi-en] Delphi where is now and where it going > > > > > > With FPC/Lazarus you get cross-platform code (write once, compile > everywhere), > > but you don't compile it to some mid-way object/assembly, etc., and > hence - > > you don't need a bloaty framework (that not so many people actually have > > these days) or resources-consuming virtual machine to run it. It's always > a > > native binary executable file. > > > > So, "goodies without the baddies", I'd say. > > > > That's at least one of the reasons to insist on Pascal. > > > > Cheers > > Mike > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Inbox full of spam? Get leading spam protection and 1GB storage with All > New Yahoo! Mail. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------- > > Home page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/delphi-en/ > > To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.3/362 - Release Date: 12/06/2006 > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> See what's inside the new Yahoo! 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