That sounds like a good idea. It will definitely clarify upfront what it means "Early Access", "Preview" and "Production Ready" for each KIP. I was looking at JIra and it seems we only have a 2 level hierarchy: Task(different types of) and Sub-Task. So we would need to change this. I was also thinking if we could use epics for this, but Epics seem to be only able to contain tasks and not sub-tasks.
Obviously this would only make sense for big KIPs. Another thing that we would need is how the release manager can easily see which KIPs change graduation step in the given release. The easy way would be use the milestone Jiras (if we can have them) containing the KIP number in the title to be easily visible. Best, On Wed, Jul 31, 2024 at 5:08 PM David Jacot <dja...@confluent.io.invalid> wrote: > We could also use a hierarchie: KIP Parent Jira > Milestones Jiras > Tasks. > > Best, > David > > On Wed, Jul 31, 2024 at 4:22 PM Josep Prat <josep.p...@aiven.io.invalid> > wrote: > > > Hi David, > > > > One of the problems I see is that the KIP index page has a 1-to-many > > relationship between KIP and release. I guess we might want to turn this > to > > a many-to-many qualified relationship. Otherwise it might be complicated > > for the release manager or the KIP driver(s) to keep the Release Plan > page > > up-to-date for the different steps. > > > > Another alternative would be to have special sub-tasks in JIRA that would > > indicate the state of the KIP, then using the "fixed version" label > they'll > > be included in the release notes and the Release Manager can look for > these > > special ones when writing announcements or making sure the release notes > > are up-to-date. > > > > Best, > > > > On Wed, Jul 31, 2024 at 3:54 PM David Jacot <dja...@confluent.io.invalid > > > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Josep, > > > > > > Thanks for starting the discussion. > > > > > > We used Early Access, Preview and GA (or Production Ready) for KIP-848 > > and > > > I find it pretty nice. We could add the tentative release plan to the > > KIP's > > > header and it could be used as the source of truth. > > > > > > Best, > > > David > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 31, 2024 at 11:53 AM Josep Prat > <josep.p...@aiven.io.invalid > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Andrew, > > > > I can definitely write a KIP, but before doing so I'd like to gather > > some > > > > feedback from the community around these steps and how they are > > perceived > > > > by different groups of people. > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 31, 2024 at 11:50 AM Andrew Schofield < > > > > andrew_schofi...@live.com> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Josep, > > > > > I think it’s high time that this was tackled. I suggest that it > would > > > be > > > > > best > > > > > handled as a KIP because then we have a document which can be > > discussed > > > > > and improved, followed by a formal vote. > > > > > > > > > > A standard set of terms with agreed meanings would be very helpful > > for > > > > > some of the larger KIPs which take many releases to be properly > ready > > > for > > > > > prime time. Most KIPs don’t need this, but a handful definitely do. > > > > > > > > > > Personally, I like the sequence that KIP-848 has taken, moving from > > > Early > > > > > Access, to Preview, and finally complete. I intend to follow the > same > > > > > sequence > > > > > for KIP-932. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Andrew > > > > > > > > > > > On 31 Jul 2024, at 10:15, Josep Prat <josep.p...@aiven.io.INVALID > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Also as part of this discussion I would like to flag that we need > > to > > > be > > > > > > able to know how we can flag this properly so it's known for the > > > > Release > > > > > > Manager. > > > > > > For example, a KIP is approved, the Jira associated with it is > > being > > > > > worked > > > > > > on. Release happens, Jira is still open, how can we flag that > this > > > KIP > > > > is > > > > > > in early access, or preview? > > > > > > > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 31, 2024 at 11:03 AM Josep Prat <josep.p...@aiven.io > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >> Hi Kafka devs, > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Lately we started using "early access", "production ready" and > > also > > > > > >> "preview" to determine the grade of "production readiness" of > the > > > > > features > > > > > >> we deliver to our community. > > > > > >> However, as far as I know, there is no official definition from > > the > > > > > Apache > > > > > >> Kafka side on which are the graduation steps for features and > what > > > > type > > > > > of > > > > > >> "guarantees" each of these offer. > > > > > >> > > > > > >> I think we should agree on which terms we should use and what > each > > > of > > > > > >> these exactly mean in terms of reliability. So far it seems we > > have > > > > this > > > > > >> graduation steps: > > > > > >> - Early Access: Feature is just complete but not yet fully > > polished > > > > and > > > > > >> maybe not used in production in many environments > > > > > >> - Preview: Feature was early access before and it underwent at > > > least a > > > > > >> cycle of improvements and fixes and it's used in some production > > > > > >> environments maybe > > > > > >> - Production ready: Feature is officially released and it > fulfills > > > the > > > > > >> expected initial needs > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Note that we don't offer any guarantees or SLA/SLO in the > > classical > > > > > term. > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Is this something we can agree on? What do those terms mean to > > you? > > > Do > > > > > we > > > > > >> need more steps? Or do we need less steps? > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Best, > > > > > >> -- > > > > > >> [image: Aiven] <https://www.aiven.io/> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> *Josep Prat* > > > > > >> Open Source Engineering Director, *Aiven* > > > > > >> josep.p...@aiven.io | +491715557497 > > > > > >> aiven.io <https://www.aiven.io/> | > > > > > >> <https://www.facebook.com/aivencloud> > > > > > >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/aiven/> < > > > > > https://twitter.com/aiven_io> > > > > > >> *Aiven Deutschland GmbH* > > > > > >> Alexanderufer 3-7, 10117 Berlin > > > > > >> Geschäftsführer: Oskari Saarenmaa, Hannu Valtonen, > > > > > >> Anna Richardson, Kenneth Chen > > > > > >> Amtsgericht Charlottenburg, HRB 209739 B > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > [image: Aiven] <https://www.aiven.io/> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Josep Prat* > > > > > > Open Source Engineering Director, *Aiven* > > > > > > josep.p...@aiven.io | +491715557497 > > > > > > aiven.io <https://www.aiven.io/> | < > > > > > https://www.facebook.com/aivencloud> > > > > > > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/aiven/> < > > > > > https://twitter.com/aiven_io> > > > > > > *Aiven Deutschland GmbH* > > > > > > Alexanderufer 3-7, 10117 Berlin > > > > > > Geschäftsführer: Oskari Saarenmaa, Hannu Valtonen, > > > > > > Anna Richardson, Kenneth Chen > > > > > > Amtsgericht Charlottenburg, HRB 209739 B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > [image: Aiven] <https://www.aiven.io> > > > > > > > > *Josep Prat* > > > > Open Source Engineering Director, *Aiven* > > > > josep.p...@aiven.io | +491715557497 > > > > aiven.io <https://www.aiven.io> | < > > > https://www.facebook.com/aivencloud > > > > > > > > > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/aiven/> < > > > > https://twitter.com/aiven_io> > > > > *Aiven Deutschland GmbH* > > > > Alexanderufer 3-7, 10117 Berlin > > > > Geschäftsführer: Oskari Saarenmaa, Hannu Valtonen, > > > > Anna Richardson, Kenneth Chen > > > > Amtsgericht Charlottenburg, HRB 209739 B > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > [image: Aiven] <https://www.aiven.io> > > > > *Josep Prat* > > Open Source Engineering Director, *Aiven* > > josep.p...@aiven.io | +491715557497 > > aiven.io <https://www.aiven.io> | < > https://www.facebook.com/aivencloud > > > > > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/aiven/> < > > https://twitter.com/aiven_io> > > *Aiven Deutschland GmbH* > > Alexanderufer 3-7, 10117 Berlin > > Geschäftsführer: Oskari Saarenmaa, Hannu Valtonen, > > Anna Richardson, Kenneth Chen > > Amtsgericht Charlottenburg, HRB 209739 B > > > -- [image: Aiven] <https://www.aiven.io> *Josep Prat* Open Source Engineering Director, *Aiven* josep.p...@aiven.io | +491715557497 aiven.io <https://www.aiven.io> | <https://www.facebook.com/aivencloud> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/aiven/> <https://twitter.com/aiven_io> *Aiven Deutschland GmbH* Alexanderufer 3-7, 10117 Berlin Geschäftsführer: Oskari Saarenmaa, Hannu Valtonen, Anna Richardson, Kenneth Chen Amtsgericht Charlottenburg, HRB 209739 B
