For now what is resulting from this thread is : * We do a survey to better know where our user are and were they are going * We check what is the status of our tools (toolchains & co) to be sure how we can "easily" use versions of java older than the one required by maven * We discuss on the ML to clearly cover all aspects of such upgrades (core vs plugins ...)
And from all of this we should be able to schedule and announce how we will update our prerequisites. WDYT ? >From my point of view there is now urgency. It is just to advance on some subject as I know they aren't easy to solve (and dev products like jenkins are analyzing such changes too). Arnaud On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 8:54 PM, Fred Cooke <fred.co...@gmail.com> wrote: > Just to clarify my comments: > > I can't and won't build anything with anything higher than J6 for the > foreseeable future, maybe upto 2 years or so, who knows. > > J7 is purely a runtime option for users for me, same for J8. J5 is dead for > both builds and runtime in my eyes. I'd prefer to maximise my choice by > keeping M3 and plugins on J6, however I wouldn't cry if M3 itself went J7, > but I would cry if the plugins went J7 without first releasing > Git-functional versions of m-release-p and m-site-p. Even then, while > wiping the tears away, I could hard code some "fixes" and release my own > fork for my own use, no biggy. > > Preference: Don't exceed J6 as a requirement for Maven or plugins. > Bottom line: I'll survive anything you do. <3 open sauce. Especially > ketchup. > > Another 2c, there is some signature difference which can result in J6-clean > source building to a J7-only binary using J7 javac. I forget the details, > but IIRC it was on the MOJO list that I learned this. Unsure if it was > added to the sniffer or not. > > Fred. > > On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 8:38 PM, Stéphane Nicoll > <stephane.nic...@gmail.com>wrote: > > > Yep. > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On 16 Jul 2013, at 20:24, "Arnaud Héritier" <aherit...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > Can you tell me if now you can see the result : > > > > > > https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Jqxq2KgSricwS7YV7pmWvHA8m7_TE7c8JhusugPmGW4/viewanalytics > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 3:37 PM, Kristian Rosenvold < > > > kristian.rosenv...@zenior.no> wrote: > > > > > >> I tucked away the last public debs of 1.5 and can release 1.5 > > >> indefinitely. In the release of the last security patch, it seems like > > >> Oracle have released approx 10 nonpublic jdk 5 versions. Shame we > can't > > >> have it. > > >> > > >> Kristian > > >> Den 16. juli 2013 14:14 skrev "Lennart Jörelid" < > > lennart.jore...@gmail.com > > >> følgende: > > >> > > >>> I rum mainly on OSX for client and some Linuxes for server - so > client > > >>> side is >= JDK 1.6 > > >>> > > >>> // vänlig hälsning, > > >>> // [sw: "best regards"], > > >>> // > > >>> // Lennart Jörelid > > >>> > > >>> 16 jul 2013 kl. 13:53 skrev Olivier Lamy <ol...@apache.org>: > > >>> > > >>>> perso osx. So only >= 1.6 > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> 2013/7/16 Stephen Connolly <stephen.alan.conno...@gmail.com>: > > >>>>> Speaking as a Maven Developer... > > >>>>> > > >>>>> My primary development machine is OS-X. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On that machine I have 1.6.0_24-b07-334, 1.7.0_17, 1.7.0_21, and > > >>> 1.7.0_25 > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I have a personal linode running 1.6.0_22, and my famous Acer > Aspire > > >> One > > >>>>> that has some Java 1.5 and 1.6 versions on it... but I have not > > turned > > >>> it > > >>>>> on more than twice since March 2011... most likely I will wipe it > and > > >>>>> reinstall some more recent linux on it which will remove the older > > JDK > > >>>>> versions leaving it with likely a 1.6 and a 1.7. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I also have a windows box sitting beside me... powered off (the Sun > > >>> Ultra > > >>>>> T-20's are noisy don't you know) I only turn it on when I *need* > > >> windows > > >>>>> and a virtual machine will not suffice (i.e. firmware updates on > > >> Samsung > > >>>>> Galaxy S... which is now only used as a game console by my son) > That > > >> has > > >>>>> Java 1.4-1.7 on it but it is far from current in terms of AV and > > >>> patches, > > >>>>> so not something I would turn on for a quick test of a release. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Effectively the lowest I can test releases is Java 1.6. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> It would be interesting to hear what the rest of the committers > have > > >> as > > >>>>> their testing capability. If very few committers have access to > Java > > >> 1.5 > > >>>>> across operating systems then I think the answer is clear... namely > > we > > >>>>> would not be in a position to stand over a release that claims to > > work > > >>> on > > >>>>> Java 1.5, and hence moving to Java 1.6 as a baseline would seem a > > good > > >>> idea. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Tools like animal-sniffer are great to help developers who cannot > set > > >> up > > >>>>> the older JVMs on their development environment... but in my > > >> experience > > >>>>> they are no substitute for running on the older JVM. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> If our test capability is basically the Windows/Java 1.5 slave and > > the > > >>>>> *nix/Java 1.5 slave on the Apache Jenkins build server *and* we > > cannot > > >>> keep > > >>>>> that integration test suite passing *then* Java 1.5 is dead for > Maven > > >>> IMHO > > >>>>> > > >>>>> -Stephen > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On 16 July 2013 11:58, Robert Patrick <robert.patr...@oracle.com> > > >>> wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>>> Oracle Java 5 and 6 are EOLed but Oracle continues to support > > >> customers > > >>>>>> using commercial products that require them that themselves are > not > > >>> EOLed. > > >>>>>> Given that current versions of Maven support Java 5 and 6, the > real > > >>>>>> question is how important is it for older applications that cannot > > >>> support > > >>>>>> Java 7 to be able to use future versions of Maven? > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> As far as I know, there is nothing from preventing Maven > developers > > >>> from > > >>>>>> using the existing versions of JDK 5/6 to build and test Maven. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> -- > > >>>>>> Robert Patrick <robert.patr...@oracle.com> > > >>>>>> VP, FMW Architects Team: The A-Team > > >>>>>> Oracle Corporation Office: +1.940.725.0011 > > >>>>>> 1148 Triple Crown Court Fax: +1.940.725.0012 > > >>>>>> Bartonville, TX 76226, USA Mobile: +1.469.556.9450 > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Professional Oracle WebLogic Server > > >>>>>> by Robert Patrick, Gregory Nyberg, and Philip Aston > > >>>>>> with Josh Bregman and Paul Done > > >>>>>> Book Home Page: http://www.wrox.com/ > > >>>>>> Kindle Version: http://www.amazon.com/ > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> -----Original Message----- > > >>>>>> From: Stephen Connolly [mailto:stephen.alan.conno...@gmail.com] > > >>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2013 3:47 AM > > >>>>>> To: Maven Developers List > > >>>>>> Subject: Re: Java version usage survey > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> I've put a question on Stack Overflow: > > >> > > > http://stackoverflow.com/questions/17671899/when-is-java-6-end-of-life-in-the-context-of-writing-developer-toolsto > > >>>>>> see if we can get something that is a bit more focus on facts. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> e.g. we are all OSS developers: thus premium/extended/sustaining > > >>> support > > >>>>>> contracts are outside our budget. If we cannot test it for free, > we > > >>> cannot > > >>>>>> support it. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> On 16 July 2013 09:01, Fred Cooke <fred.co...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>>> My 2c: > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> - J7 on Mac is unstable (trust me...) and non-performant, and > > >> thus I > > >>>>>>> require my users to use Apple's J6 on the Mac. > > >>>>>>> - On Linux there are lots of Swing bugs in all versions, but a > lot > > >>>>>> less > > >>>>>>> in J7 than J6, so I recommend J7 for Linux guys. > > >>>>>>> - I don't use J5 for anything at all and none of my code can run > > >> on > > >>> it > > >>>>>>> due to basics that are missing there. > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> I didn't distinguish vendors because the comments apply across > all > > >> of > > >>>>>>> them anyway. > > >>>>>>> Fred. > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 9:29 AM, Chris Graham < > > chrisgw...@gmail.com > > >>> > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> Hi Arnaud. > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> You need to at least add an OTHER (ie non oracle) entry as well. > > >> You > > >>>>>>>> you can track Oracle java 6 and Non-Oracle java 6. > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> -Chris > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Arnaud Héritier > > >>>>>>>> <aherit...@gmail.com > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> Good point. I updated the survey to tell it is the Oracle JDK > EOL > > >>>>>>>>> Survey : > > >>> > https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Jqxq2KgSricwS7YV7pmWvHA8m7_TE7c8Jhusu > > >>>>>>> gPmGW4/viewform > > >>>>>>>>> Replies : > > >>> > https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Jqxq2KgSricwS7YV7pmWvHA8m7_TE7c8Jhusu > > >>>>>>> gPmGW4/viewanalytics > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 8:06 AM, Chris Graham > > >>>>>>>>> <chrisgw...@gmail.com> > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 10:07 AM, Arnaud Héritier < > > >>>>>>> aherit...@gmail.com > > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> Hi, > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> Java 6 EOL was in feb and Maven and its plugins are always > > >>>>>>>> compatible > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> Oracle Java 6 was EOL'd. > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> IBM Java 6 was, and is not due to be for a few more years. > They > > >>>>>>>>>> even > > >>>>>>>>>> *extended* 1.5's life for a year. Sept this year, I think. > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> -Chris > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> -- > > >>>>>>>>> ----- > > >>>>>>>>> Arnaud Héritier > > >>>>>>>>> http://aheritier.net > > >>>>>>>>> Mail/GTalk: aheritier AT gmail DOT com Twitter/Skype : > aheritier > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org > > >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> -- > > >>>> Olivier Lamy > > >>>> Ecetera: http://ecetera.com.au > > >>>> http://twitter.com/olamy | http://linkedin.com/in/olamy > > >>>> > > >>>> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org > > >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org > > >>> > > >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org > > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > ----- > > > Arnaud Héritier > > > http://aheritier.net > > > Mail/GTalk: aheritier AT gmail DOT com > > > Twitter/Skype : aheritier > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@maven.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@maven.apache.org > > > > > -- ----- Arnaud Héritier http://aheritier.net Mail/GTalk: aheritier AT gmail DOT com Twitter/Skype : aheritier
