It was a long discussion that was done in the public lists and I wouldn't want to rehash it (you have been part of it for sure): there were concerns and discussions about duplicated jars, poor quality code, stale code, files with questionable licenses etc... on the other side there were people worried about removing features from the system etc... I think it would be better to address each component individually and, since you would like to "cope with missing specialpurpose components in released packages", this is why I am asking you what are the components that should be included in the trunk/release branch/releases.
Jacopo On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 1:55 PM, Jacques Le Roux < jacques.le.r...@les7arts.com> wrote: > I think we need to be sure of what we are doing. > > 1st question, is why in the 1st place we did that? What pushed us to do so? > > Jacques > > Le 14/11/2014 12:47, Jacopo Cappellato a écrit : > > What is your preference? Would you like to see them all in the release >> packages? Some of them only? Which ones? >> >> >> >> On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 12:38 PM, Jacques Le Roux < >> jacques.le.r...@les7arts.com> wrote: >> >> This is the easiest part, I was more thinking about how much is >>> downloaded >>> by users. >>> >>> Anyway this was just an idea to help user to cope with missing >>> specialpurpose components in released packages. >>> >>> Now a question comes to my mind, I don't clearly remember the reasons we >>> decided to remove them. Why keeping them in the releases branches but not >>> not in released packages is not clear to me. >>> >>> I believe Jacopo kind of answered at http://markmail.org/message/ >>> w3xw6lipifdeks3z >>> Actually we need to clarify 1st which components to keep active in >>> release >>> branches. For now it seems only ecommerce which is for me too >>> restrictive. >>> And then discuss about why not doing the same in released packages (sorry >>> if I missed some arguments here). >>> For that we need first to exactly know which components affect which >>> ones. >>> I believe at this stage we don't want to send any specialpurpose >>> component >>> to Attic, but this might be discussed also. >>> >>> Jacques >>> >>> Le 13/11/2014 22:51, Pierre Smits a écrit : >>> >>> That is not difficult to assess. Do a download from trunk, and see how >>> >>>> many Mb's are transferred. Do a ./ant clean-all. Subsequently remove all >>>> hidden files in .svn folders. Finally do a zip of the cleaned download >>>> and >>>> compare the original amount of Mb's with the size of the zip file. That >>>> difference is what is saved on storage and transfer cost of trunk code. >>>> >>>> Now multiply that with the number of branches you had in mind. >>>> >>>> Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPad >>>> >>>> Op 13 nov. 2014 om 22:32 heeft Jacques Le Roux < >>>> >>>>> jacques.le.r...@les7arts.com> het volgende geschreven: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Le 13/11/2014 21:25, Ron Wheeler a écrit : >>>>> >>>>> Is it Apache's concern that while people may be free to choose, ASF >>>>>> server capacity is not free nor unlimited? >>>>>> >>>>>> I doubt that OFBiz really puts a big load on the ASF infrastructure >>>>>> but >>>>>> users are not supposed to be downloading from the SVN. >>>>>> They are supposed to get downloads from local mirrors. >>>>>> >>>>>> You said it :) At the moment I don't fear any overload on the svn >>>>> server >>>>> from users downloading from releases branches instead of released >>>>> packages. >>>>> OFBiz is not Tomcat ;) >>>>> But I must say I have no measures, so you got a point >>>>> until-we/if-we-can >>>>> discover that. Because users can already do that, I think it's fair to >>>>> use >>>>> this method as long as it's reasonable. >>>>> Of course, having that suggested in a TLP project could be viewed as an >>>>> abuse from the Board, but let's be pragmatic, numbers should tell us >>>>> the >>>>> truth (if can get them) >>>>> >>>>> That may be the practical side of Apache's urging to get the releases >>>>> >>>>>> following their guidelines. >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes for Tomcat, HTTPD or such that's understandable. For OFBiz I >>>>> "fear" >>>>> it's not a problem. Can we discuss with the board in case, instead of >>>>> hiding behind unknown numbers? >>>>> >>>>> Jacques >>>>> >>>>> Ron >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 13/11/2014 3:13 PM, Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Le 13/11/2014 20:03, Ron Wheeler a écrit : >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Does this solve ASF's issue about having users access the main >>>>>>>> servers? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I don't try to solve an issue, just to propose an alternative. >>>>>>> It's a >>>>>>> free user choice, but with more elements >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What do you put on the mirrors and how do you stop users from >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> accessing the development SVN which is ASF's concern? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Things stay as they are, it's only that we inform our users than >>>>>>> another way is possible and we give them enough elements of >>>>>>> comparison to >>>>>>> choice, it's called freedom >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jacques >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Ron >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 13/11/2014 1:55 PM, Jacques Le Roux wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> For the licence free issues (an other related stuff) we could put a >>>>>>>>> disclaimer in the wiki page where all alternatives would be >>>>>>>>> explained >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Jacques >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Le 13/11/2014 12:38, Jacopo Cappellato a écrit : >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> In the past the ASF Board asked to the OFBiz PMC to fix the >>>>>>>>>> release >>>>>>>>>> strategy of the project by providing officially voted release >>>>>>>>>> files >>>>>>>>>> thru >>>>>>>>>> the ASF mirrors: at that time we were pushing the users to get the >>>>>>>>>> trunk. >>>>>>>>>> Officially asking the user to use a release branch would be better >>>>>>>>>> than the >>>>>>>>>> trunk but would bring back similar concerns: an official vote is >>>>>>>>>> required >>>>>>>>>> to publish a product to the outside of the project in order to >>>>>>>>>> guarantee >>>>>>>>>> License free issues etc... >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Nov 13, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Jacques Le Roux < >>>>>>>>>> jacques.le.r...@les7arts.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> In a recent user ML threadhttp://markmail.org/ >>>>>>>>>>> message/ivjocjr2ull7lwqe I >>>>>>>>>>> suggested we could propose our users to use a release branch >>>>>>>>>>> strategy >>>>>>>>>>> rather than downloaded packages. >>>>>>>>>>> And that we could expose this way of doing in our download page, >>>>>>>>>>> or maybe >>>>>>>>>>> better with a link to an explaining page (in details) in the >>>>>>>>>>> wiki. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I know it's not the recommended way of doing at the ASF. But we >>>>>>>>>>> all know >>>>>>>>>>> the OFBiz differences when compared with other TLPs which are >>>>>>>>>>> mostly libs, >>>>>>>>>>> and even mostly jars. >>>>>>>>>>> Most of us are actually using this way in their custom projects >>>>>>>>>>> and I have >>>>>>>>>>> a feeling it would not only help our users but also us to support >>>>>>>>>>> them. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> What do you think? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Jacques >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>
