Hi Mathias,
Mathias Bauer wrote:
Hi Sophie,
Sophie wrote:
I feel that currently there is a deep smog on our communication flow,
see Rene's feeling today, mine on l10n, others on lingu list, may be a
not so well balanced mail from Bjoern, whatever the great work he has
done and the not answered question from Volker about odficons01. I guess
we have some strange times to pass along. That should not disturb us
from what we have to do: keep the community strong, working in
confidence, attach importance to what really has, and forget the rest.
Your last sentence really is a wise one and I thank you very much for
it. But at the beginning of this paragraph you mixed very different
things and put them together though they have completely different
backgrounds.
Yes, but even though, they have the same resonance.
I don't know much about the things on l10n, linguistic and
odficons, but my own experience from may years lets me think that they
are the usual consequences of bad communication and mistakes on what
side ever - just normal life that happens at times, not only currently.
(Doesn't make it better, but also not an extraordinary event). The
problems mentioned in the release status meeting are somewhat similar,
though I dislike the reaction to them in the meeting.
If people make mistakes, this shouldn't be brushed under the carpet.
Nevertheless discussions about the mistakes should happen in a
respectful manner and with an appropriate tone. So if you mention Rene's
feeling in the meeting, what about the feelings of those being talked to
so rudely as it is documented in the IRC logs of several meetings?
Actually I feel like being a check box that has been unmarked, the
option is no more the 'community voice' by default. This is what I'm
highlighting, not the facts one by one (this should be discuss on the
corresponding list of the corresponding projects).
When you feel like that, you have several ways to react, it depends on
human behavior, we are also a society.
Now to the other things that IMHO should be seen as something different.
I don't think that Björn's mail was unbalanced. There is only one person
(Eric Bachard) that obviously read it as a personal attack. As Eric is
already known to take nearly everything personally, I wouldn't give that
too much attention. And Björn and I have reacted immediately to Eric's
mail (though it was quite impolite), just to make things clear.
Moreover, all the work from Björn has been presented and discussed on
the dev list upfront, nothing was done in secrecy. I can't see how we
could have done that much better (perhaps except of adding a footer
"This mail is not an attack against the education project or one of its
members" to every mail sent to an OOo list). There will always be people
who misunderstand even the most balanced mails you can think of. If you
are looking for not so well balanced mails: take the reply from Eric to
Björn (though IMHO naming it "not so well balanced" would be an euphemism).
The unbalanced was between the mail and the disclaimer on the wiki.
Sorry that I didn't explain myself better adding confusion on something
I found important. (BTW I never read Eric Bachard mails since almost 2
years or really by accident, this is irrelevant to my eyes).
Björn has done a very important work and we should be all really
thankfull to him. [you know there is always a but, here it comes ;-) ]
But, when I saw this warning at the top of the log of the release
minutes page [1], I thought of a contributor, where English is really
not his beloved language. He will go away asap and won't contribute
anymore once he has tried to read/understand this message. This not the
goal of the wiki to discourage contributions... I will discuss this on
the doc project when I have some time, but I wanted to clarify my "not
so balanced" assertion.
And Martin's blog? He has reasons not to vote for Thorsten and IMHO he
is totally entitled to have them. He made them public to demonstrate
that his "no" vote for Thorsten is not founded in personal problems with
him, on the contrary: he doesn't want to give his vote to Thorsten in
spite of the respect and sympathy he has for him in person. I can't see
anything wrong here.
I've nothing to say about Martin's blog, it is his position, I respect
it and have said nothing on it.
Still my position is to bring importance to what really has or is.
Currently, communication in the product development area is going
completely wrong, this should be underlined and the contributor willing
to endorse the function of representation at the CC should be aware of
the area covered by its role and its importance.
[1] http://tinyurl.com/y9qkbme
Kind regards
Sophie
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