A quick update from my side regarding the docker experiments: The biggest block I have right now is to get the AIR runtime working inside a linux container.
There are a few hacks available to try amd force it, but I could never get it to work unfortunately. Thanks, Om On Fri, Mar 8, 2019, 2:13 AM Carlos Rovira <carlosrov...@apache.org> wrote: > Hi Alex, > > amazing work! congrats to reach to this point! :) > > I need to put my head on all of this, but count on me to be a RM. I think > the best thing should be that you be the first RM to try your own > development at least for the first time, and then the rest of us will > follow you on the next releases. With all this on place we maybe could > release once a month or every two months... > > Thanks for doing this :) > > Carlos > > > El vie., 8 mar. 2019 a las 1:55, Alex Harui (<aha...@adobe.com.invalid>) > escribió: > > > OK, I've now seen Jenkins perform the steps to build the release > > artifacts. Folks interested in Docker-izing the steps are welcome to > look > > at the jobs on the "Royale Release" tab on the CI server. > > > http://apacheroyaleci.westus2.cloudapp.azure.com:8080/view/Royale%20Release/ > > > > These steps assume that the RM can run the basic Maven and Ant build on > > the RM's computer. I think that's a fair requirement since all of us on > the > > PMC need to able to do that to build the RC in order to vote on it. > > Jenkins does other tasks like run the Maven release plugin steps. > > > > Currently that results in binaries on Jenkins that are downloaded to the > > RM's computer. These binaries need to be verified by the RM which is the > > next phase I will be starting on now. The RM verifies the bits and then > > PGP signs them. And then the bits are uploaded off the RM's computer to > > Maven Staging or dist.a.o/dev. If that uploading turns out to be a > point > > of failure, we have the option of having Jenkins upload the big files and > > have the RM only upload PGP signature files. Or finding a way for > Jenkins > > to get the signature files from the RM. The uploads worked fine for me, > > but then again, so did the old script's uploads. > > > > Therefore, once I get the binary verification phase completed, I think > > someone other than me should be the RM and try to use these steps to > > generate the release and help debug the process for the next RM. So, > > please try to carve out some time to be the RM. One advantage of doing > > most of the work on Jenkins is that it frees up my computer to do other > > things while Jenkins is cranking away. > > > > I think we're at least a week away from binary verification, maybe two, > so > > it is time to start thinking about what is going in this release. > > > > Thanks, > > -Alex > > > > On 3/7/19, 4:15 PM, "Alex Harui" <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote: > > > > In case you haven't guessed, I'm testing out Jenkins and its ability > > to create the artifacts and send emails. Please ignore any email that > > looks like a vote or discuss thread. > > > > Thanks, > > -Alex > > > > On 2/10/19, 8:44 PM, "Alex Harui" <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote: > > > > Om, > > > > Well, that's what I used for the last release. I'm sure there is > > probably some inaccuracy in it. > > > > That said, I'm abandoning that document and taking a new angle > > because that document presumed that the release manager was trying to > > create a release on his/her computer. I've given up on that and working > on > > making releases from a shared computer for the reasons I've stated > > upthread. I hope to make some progress on that this week. > > > > The key difference is that the new angle does not presume that > you > > have Git SSH and PGP signatures all set up on some computer. I have not > > looked into how Docker would handle that. You certainly wouldn't want > the > > Docker image to contain your SSH or PGP keys/creds. And if the Docker > > image doesn't, then that is another stumbling block for future RMs. > > > > The other key difference is that the old script presumed you > could > > create the 3 release in 3 huge "easy" steps. We've seen that is only > true > > for me. So the new angle creates many discrete steps managed by Jenkins. > > > > So, it is up to you to decide what you want to "Docker-ize". You > > can try to Docker-ize the current 3 big steps, so RMs can try to run it > on > > their systems, but I'd bet they will just faiI due to network issues. I > > would be interested in using Docker to make each of these many discrete > > steps portable to another server. I'm not going to involve Docker at > this > > point. My main goal is just to see if I can create a workflow of many > > discrete steps that isn't horribly painful. Once we see what these steps > > turn out to be, then we can worry about server portability of those > steps. > > > > Either way, we want to know about running Browser+Selenium for > > sure. And maybe FlashPlayerDebugger or AIR. I would want to know, for > > example, how you debug a failing checkintest in a Docker container. > > > > Thanks, > > -Alex > > > > > > On 2/10/19, 5:18 PM, "OmPrakash Muppirala" <bigosma...@gmail.com > > > > wrote: > > > > Alex, > > > > Just to be clear, I am following the steps from here to try > > and setup a > > docker container. > > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fapache%2Froyale-asjs%2Fwiki%2FRelease-Manager-Notes&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=rJsHtgUQ%2BH5iQOXlZc%2FCEvtxH0Lm25fGn0wlAe6oqSs%3D&reserved=0 > > > > Is this doc up to date? > > > > Thanks, > > Om > > > > On Wed, Feb 6, 2019 at 12:02 PM OmPrakash Muppirala < > > bigosma...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > One approach is to have each step in the process spin up a > > docker image. > > > And use docker-compose to run each step. All the images > can > > be made to > > > share a common volume where all the artifacts are stored > > across steps. > > > > > > You are right about the networking issue though. Any > > network related > > > failure that occurs on the host machine will most likely > > occur in the > > > docker container. Although, I am not clear how we can > > guarantee that the > > > same issues will not occur on the Jenkins server. I mean, > > what is special > > > about the Jenkins server that makes it immune to these > > networking issues? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Om > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 6, 2019 at 11:48 AM Alex Harui > > <aha...@adobe.com.invalid> > > > wrote: > > > > > >> Again, I don't know anything about Docker, but before we > > spend a lot of > > >> time on Docker, I also want to point out that the process > > to create a > > >> release cannot really be thought of as "one application". > > It will be a > > >> series of "steps" to run. How many steps depends on > > whether we think we > > >> can isolate enough stuff via Docker to be able to run > > Docker on the RM's > > >> computer instead of some shared computer. On a shared > > computer there will > > >> be dozens of steps because the RM will need to enter > > passwords to commit > > >> stuff. On a local computer I guess the RM can supply > > passwords but I think > > >> there will be stopping points where the Maven artifacts > are > > deployed and > > >> the staging repo is closed, and another stopping point for > > the vote. It > > >> seems like Docker works by downloading dependencies. > Given > > that the > > >> problem the RMs had last time involved downloads and > > uploads, why do we > > >> think Docker will really solve this for creating releases > > on local machines? > > >> > > >> The reason to do this on a shared machine is so that new > > RMs don't have > > >> to do as much setup. But then I wonder about the > > efficiency of kicking off > > >> that many Docker images. Jenkins can manage that already. > > Does Docker > > >> have some sort of similar Dashboard or would we use > Jenkins > > to kick off > > >> Docker steps? I can't quite picture what is the outermost > > >> control/dashboard. > > >> > > >> -Alex > > >> > > >> On 2/6/19, 11:03 AM, "Harbs" <harbs.li...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > >> > > >> A quick search turns up this: > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcodingsans.com%2Fblog%2Fselenium-with-docker-testing&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=fA7bthRUAGXzqJdmK4raheZMEHQ4qyy3NHXjufAF6jc%3D&reserved=0 > > >> < > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcodingsans.com%2Fblog%2Fselenium-with-docker-testing&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=fA7bthRUAGXzqJdmK4raheZMEHQ4qyy3NHXjufAF6jc%3D&reserved=0 > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.blazemeter.com%2Fblog%2Fhow-to-run-selenium-tests-in-docker&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=QeJ5h98H2ghmY%2BMoGWKVgYaS6OKiv9BY7Cbu%2FRYh9K0%3D&reserved=0 > > >> < > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.blazemeter.com%2Fblog%2Fhow-to-run-selenium-tests-in-docker&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=QeJ5h98H2ghmY%2BMoGWKVgYaS6OKiv9BY7Cbu%2FRYh9K0%3D&reserved=0 > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2FSeleniumHQ%2Fdocker-selenium&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=pvNt%2B4Spevu9uXaZeX1bV4AKi3p1KVnwND4XZvqlxt0%3D&reserved=0 > > >> < > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2FSeleniumHQ%2Fdocker-selenium&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=pvNt%2B4Spevu9uXaZeX1bV4AKi3p1KVnwND4XZvqlxt0%3D&reserved=0 > > >> > > > >> > > >> > On Feb 6, 2019, at 8:59 PM, Alex Harui > > <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > > >> > Thanks for volunteering to try it Om. IMO, even > more > > important > > >> than Firefox+Flash is SomeBrowser+Selenium. We may also > > need to run Adobe > > >> AIR's adb. We could probably turn off the Flash tests or > > replace Flash > > >> with AIR. > > >> > > > >> > Thanks, > > >> > -Alex > > >> > > > >> > On 2/6/19, 10:54 AM, "Carlos Rovira" < > > carlosrov...@apache.org> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > > >> > Hi Om, that would be great! waiting for your > > experience with a > > >> that! :) > > >> > > > >> > El mié., 6 feb. 2019 a las 19:31, OmPrakash > > Muppirala (< > > >> bigosma...@gmail.com>) > > >> > escribió: > > >> > > > >> >> Yes, I agree with Alex about not being able to run > > UI out of docker > > >> >> containers. I never thought of the checkintests > > when I made the > > >> >> suggestion. > > >> >> > > >> >> The firefox-flash image that Yishay pointed out > > looks promising. > > >> I will > > >> >> poke around with it and see if that works for us. > > >> >> > > >> >> Thanks, > > >> >> Om > > >> >> > > >> >> On Wed, Feb 6, 2019 at 12:41 AM Yishay Weiss < > > >> yishayj...@hotmail.com> > > >> >> wrote: > > >> >> > > >> >>> I’ll let Om or someone else with docker experience > > tell us if > > >> this [1] is > > >> >>> relevant. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> [1] > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fhub.docker.com%2Fr%2Fbeli%2Ffirefox-flash%2F&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505592396&sdata=O5WCCm7fcFGjaXpoDum5hMAJXl3JWscFMRMywpBAN1w%3D&reserved=0 > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> ________________________________ > > >> >>> From: Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> > > >> >>> Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2019 10:05:54 AM > > >> >>> To: dev@royale.apache.org > > >> >>> Subject: Re: 0.9.6 Release > > >> >>> > > >> >>> I don't anything about docker, but in 15 minutes > of > > reading I ran > > >> into > > >> >>> this: > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >> > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.channelfutures.com%2Fopen-source%2Fwhen-not-to-use-docker-understanding-the-limitations-of-containers&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505602405&sdata=bjIQhi1pOBfBd8jQAc0XmbrsWzlDwSqieUiUoSovnIE%3D&reserved=0 > > >> >>> > > >> >>> Which says: Docker can't " Run applications with > > graphical > > >> interfaces". > > >> >>> If you want Royale to use Docker for releases, > show > > that it can > > >> run > > >> >>> checkintests with Flash and the Browser. Then I > > will look into > > >> it more. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> The highest level goal is to make it as easy as > > possible for > > >> someone to > > >> >>> volunteer to be an RM. Any requirement of > "install > > this (Docker, > > >> etc) on > > >> >>> your computer" is, IMO, another barrier to entry. > > Yeah, RMs will > > >> have to > > >> >>> have Maven installed and maybe Ant, but you should > > already have > > >> those > > >> >>> installed to be a committer/PMC member. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> That said, a good takeaway from the Docker idea is > > to try to find > > >> a way > > >> >> to > > >> >>> make an "Image" of whatever we end up with on > > whatever server we > > >> end up > > >> >>> using so if the image can be copied and used on > > other servers. > > >> I'm not > > >> >>> exactly sure how to do that with Azure, which > hosts > > my CI > > >> server. I will > > >> >>> spend a few more minutes researching that. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> I could not quickly find any way to get a free VM > > on Azure or AWS > > >> that > > >> >>> isn't a free-trial-start-paying-after-a-year. So, > > unless someone > > >> comes > > >> >> up > > >> >>> with a free server we can use "forever", I'm going > > to just start > > >> with my > > >> >>> Azure VM. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> -Alex > > >> >>> > > >> >>> On 2/5/19, 10:59 PM, "Carlos Rovira" < > > carlosrov...@apache.org> > > >> wrote: > > >> >>> > > >> >>> Hi. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> the plan sounds very good to me. Just my 2 > > thoughts on this: > > >> >>> > > >> >>> 1.- As I was reading I was thinking as well on > > something like > > >> Docker > > >> >>> and > > >> >>> see Om as well thinking on the same. Maybe is > > the way to this > > >> with > > >> >> the > > >> >>> actual technology. Seems VMs are stepping out a > > bit this days > > >> in > > >> >> favor > > >> >>> of > > >> >>> things like Docker. Maybe the same did Git over > > Svn, and today > > >> Svn is > > >> >>> an > > >> >>> old remembrance. I must say that I have no > > experience with > > >> Docker, so > > >> >>> doing > > >> >>> that will require acquire that knowledge, but > > seems it could > > >> be worth > > >> >>> it. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> 2.- Maybe is not possible, but I want to > propose > > to do this > > >> work I a > > >> >>> separate branch, so it could be in parallel to > > other > > >> developments. I > > >> >>> think > > >> >>> work over develop is practical if there's > > something tiny that > > >> could > > >> >> be > > >> >>> done > > >> >>> in a commit. But as we need more than one, or > is > > a long > > >> process (like > > >> >>> this), chances are to make develop branch > > unstable and even > > >> for some > > >> >>> days. > > >> >>> I think we should try to avoid that scenario, > > and branches are > > >> the > > >> >> best > > >> >>> way. If we do this way, we'll benefit of more > > reliable develop > > >> >> branch. > > >> >>> > > >> >>> Thanks and good to know of this plan :) > > >> >>> > > >> >>> Carlos > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> El mar., 5 feb. 2019 a las 23:19, Harbs (< > > >> harbs.li...@gmail.com>) > > >> >>> escribió: > > >> >>> > > >> >>>> I’ve never used Docker myself, but that might be > a > > good plan. > > >> >>>> > > >> >>>>> On Feb 6, 2019, at 12:07 AM, OmPrakash > Muppirala < > > >> >>> bigosma...@gmail.com> > > >> >>>> wrote: > > >> >>>>> > > >> >>>>> I was wondering if we can use docker images to > > setup and seal > > >> the > > >> >>> RM > > >> >>>>> environment. Then other RMs simply need to run > > the image > > >> locally > > >> >>> and run > > >> >>>>> the release scripts. Might be easier. If folks > > like this plan, > > >> >> I > > >> >>> can > > >> >>>> try > > >> >>>>> to put something together. > > >> >>>>> > > >> >>>>> Thanks, > > >> >>>>> Om > > >> >>>>> > > >> >>>>> On Tue, Feb 5, 2019 at 1:40 PM Harbs < > > harbs.li...@gmail.com> > > >> >>> wrote: > > >> >>>>> > > >> >>>>>> In a recent discussion, it looks like other > > projects have > > >> gotten > > >> >>>> resources > > >> >>>>>> from AWS. > > >> >>>>>> > > >> >>>>>> Whatever service we use, could setup a “shared” > > Royale account > > >> >>> that all > > >> >>>>>> PMC members could have access to. > > >> >>>>>> > > >> >>>>>> I don’t know if there’s some way we could > > leverage Gitlab’s > > >> >>> integration > > >> >>>>>> pipelines > > >> >>> > > >> >> > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.gitlab.com%2Fee%2Fci%2FREADME.html&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505602405&sdata=ZrqmL9%2B0oXasDm4aDW2q8K%2F%2BEkSc17zQerzJ4m%2BM7lU%3D&reserved=0 > > >> >>> < > > >> >>>>>> > > >> >>> > > >> >> > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.gitlab.com%2Fee%2Fci%2FREADME.html&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505602405&sdata=ZrqmL9%2B0oXasDm4aDW2q8K%2F%2BEkSc17zQerzJ4m%2BM7lU%3D&reserved=0 > > >> >>>> > > >> >>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>> On Feb 5, 2019, at 11:33 PM, Alex Harui > > >> >> <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID > > >> >>>> > > >> >>>>>> wrote: > > >> >>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>> Well, the big hole in this plan is that I > think > > we have to use > > >> >>>> someone's > > >> >>>>>> personal VM account (in this case, mine). I > > can't think of a > > >> >> way > > >> >>> we can > > >> >>>>>> run interactive commands like git push on > builds@. > > But that > > >> >>> reminds me > > >> >>>>>> to go see what are current options are for > > free/cheap compute > > >> >>> servers. > > >> >>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>> On 2/5/19, 1:20 PM, "Piotr Zarzycki" < > > >> >> piotrzarzyck...@gmail.com> > > >> >>>> wrote: > > >> >>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>> Sounds like best plan ever. Using the same PC > > by everyone is > > >> >>> awesome! > > >> >>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>> On Tue, Feb 5, 2019, 8:39 PM Harbs < > > harbs.li...@gmail.com > > >> >>> wrote: > > >> >>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>> A big +1 from me! > > >> >>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>> Looking forward! > > >> >>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>>> On Feb 5, 2019, at 9:34 PM, Alex Harui > > >> >>> <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> > > >> >>>>>> wrote: > > >> >>>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>>> Hi, > > >> >>>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>>> We are coming up on 3 months since 0.9.4. I > > have finished > > >> >> the > > >> >>>> changes > > >> >>>>>>>> to get production Royale modules to work in > > Tour De Flex. > > >> >> Lots > > >> >>> of > > >> >>>> other > > >> >>>>>>>> good changes have been contributed. > > >> >>>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>>> There were emails around the 0.9.4 release > > about others > > >> >>> stepping up > > >> >>>> to > > >> >>>>>>>> cut the next release, but that hasn't > > happened. I tried and > > >> >>> failed to > > >> >>>>>> get > > >> >>>>>>>> Apache Infra to allow us to run our release > > packaging on the > > >> >>> Jenkins > > >> >>>>>>>> servers. They felt there were too many > > security concerns > > >> with > > >> >>> having > > >> >>>>>> the > > >> >>>>>>>> servers push changes to Git and PGP sign > > artifacts. > > >> >>>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>>> However, we MUST find a way for other RMs to > > be successful. > > >> >>> There is > > >> >>>>>> no > > >> >>>>>>>> way I should or want to be the only RM. But > I > > have an idea > > >> >> that > > >> >>>>>> involves > > >> >>>>>>>> creating a long list of Jenkins jobs on my CI > > server that add > > >> >>> up to > > >> >>>> the > > >> >>>>>>>> release. The RM would log into Jenkins and > > run some job > > >> >> titled > > >> >>>> "Apache > > >> >>>>>>>> Royale Release Step 1", then wait for an > email > > indicating > > >> that > > >> >>> it > > >> >>>>>> completed > > >> >>>>>>>> and follow instructions in the email, such as > > logging into > > >> the > > >> >>> CI > > >> >>>> server > > >> >>>>>>>> via Remote Desktop, opening a command prompt > > and running "git > > >> >>> push" > > >> >>>> and > > >> >>>>>>>> entering his/her username and password. Then > > run the next > > >> job > > >> >>> and so > > >> >>>>>> on. > > >> >>>>>>>> There will be a point where the RM has to > > download the build > > >> >>>> artifacts, > > >> >>>>>>>> verify them, then PGP sign them, and upload > > them. That will > > >> >> be > > >> >>> a > > >> >>>> likely > > >> >>>>>>>> point of failure, but that step should be a > > single Maven > > >> >>> command and > > >> >>>>>> thus > > >> >>>>>>>> can be restarted until it finally succeeds. > > Then more > > >> Jenkins > > >> >>> jobs > > >> >>>>>> will be > > >> >>>>>>>> run. But if this works then folks won't have > > to setup their > > >> >>> computers > > >> >>>>>> to > > >> >>>>>>>> be an RM. > > >> >>>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>>> So, prepare for lots of commits and reverts > > as I try to put > > >> >>> this > > >> >>>>>>>> together. I'm guessing it won't actually > work > > until the last > > >> >>> week of > > >> >>>>>>>> February at the earliest so there is no big > > rush to get other > > >> >>> stuff in > > >> >>>>>> for > > >> >>>>>>>> this release, and if we get it to work, > > hopefully we'll > > >> >> release > > >> >>> more > > >> >>>>>> often > > >> >>>>>>>> with other folks being the RM. > > >> >>>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>>> -Alex > > >> >>>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>>> > > >> >>>>>> > > >> >>>>>> > > >> >>>> > > >> >>>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> -- > > >> >>> Carlos Rovira > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >> > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505602405&sdata=egeH1lqxrifO9sWYd0PO67pKuQP6Riv0N2tEDf9rriA%3D&reserved=0 > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > -- > > >> > Carlos Rovira > > >> > > > >> > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C9a4f659f80694687c3cd08d6a35b378d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636876009505602405&sdata=egeH1lqxrifO9sWYd0PO67pKuQP6Riv0N2tEDf9rriA%3D&reserved=0 > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Carlos Rovira > http://about.me/carlosrovira >
