On Friday 12 December 2008 23:07, Florent Daignière wrote: > > I'm not really trying to discuss how the builds should be signed > > (another discussion really), > > No, it's not. THEY SHOULD NOT BE SIGNED ON EMU EITHER! and it's not > because we are doing it wrong at the moment that we should extend the > "bad" behaviour.
You criticised me for inserting my own builds rather than emu's, on the grounds that emu's builds are more easily verified. Now you say installers should be totally bereft of any form of verifiability, compiled on a dev's private machine using his private JVM? Or that they should be generated on emu and then signed on a dev's private machine, which would be even worse as it gives two possibilities for compromise? I know you privately think we shouldn't distribute any binaries whatsoever, but practically speaking what is your proposed architecture here? > > > but trying to figure out why you can sign > > the compiled .jars, but not the compiled .exe installer? > > jarsigner is bundled in any jdk; I don't know any PE signer for linux. Nor an open source command line PE signer that can run on Wine? > > > >> 2) The topic wasn't really about which platform to pack on, but if to > > >> build and pack on the same platform. It isn't preferred to build > > >> applications for platform A on platform B, but since we have 1 emu, > > >> which runs platform B, we will have to do with that. AHK is supported by > > >> Wine, which runs on Linux, so I don't really see the big problem > > >> (besides spending time installing Wine, which we already have an > > >> argument going on about) > > > > > > You are thinking about your installer here and not others. Tomorrow > > > sanity will want his macos installer to be built there too; how do you > > > do that? What about win64? ... > > > > So because we have the possibility to do improvements for one platform, > > we shouldn't - because we might not be able to do so for all the other > > platforms? I'd say thats a poor policy. I think it is just fine to use > > native installers where possible, and fall back to a generic for > > platforms we cannot support with native installers (or packages, or dmg > > files or whatever). > > I don't care what you'd say. You are pushing for infrastructure changes > to be made: you are the one making demands here. The policy is what it > is: special cases suck and should be avoided. It's not like there wasn't > any alternative. The current installer sucks. Zero3's proposed installer will be much quicker, in the sense that the user will no longer have to click next 6 times. For Windows, that's an improvement. On the other hand, the current installer is quite acceptable for linux until we have packages, for OS/X until we have some OS/X developers, and for distros for which we don't have packages. It is easier to correctly use than a tarball. > > > > > > I happen to be familiar with both the installation-related issues and > > > the infrastructure ones and that's why the debate is mostly in between > > > you and me. The catch is that I am not willing to spend time on it; I am > > > not interested by native installers anymore. > > > > If I look back at the discussions we've had the last couple of weeks, > > I'd say you have been acting like that from the start of. Hell, even > > back when I wrote the Windows update script I met the same attitude. > > > > Good thing that other people can look into it when you don't want to, then. > > Don't worry: that's the last reply you will get from me. I have more > important things to spare my free time on. Okay so you concede. I'll install a Windows VM on emu then! :) Seriously, if you don't want to maintain emu, it will cost me a whole load of work and a lot more reading, PLEASE TELL US, leaving emu without anyone maintaining it is unacceptable. And I would just like to point out again that nextgens has done a lot more for FPI than any other active volunteer developer, although lately he has been sulking and talking about leaving. His views have to be taken into account. But so do Zero3's, especially if nextgens keeps to his repeated threat of leaving.
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