On 1/1/15 2:48 AM, Joakim wrote:
On Monday, 29 December 2014 at 19:11:04 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
On 12/29/14 10:58 AM, Joakim wrote:
It also means more people asking for stuff, then doing nothing to
contribute towards it, as though the D community is their slave labor.
If we, the D community, want D to succeed, we must change this
attitude. -- Andrei
I was just going to let this go without answering, as it's ambiguous,
but since Dicebot just said something similar to what I'd have said,
I'll bite. What do you mean by this? That the people asking for stuff
then doing nothing have to change their attitude or those in the D
community, like Dicebot and me, who point out that their approach is
unrealistic should change our attitude?
Heh, I now see how that's ambiguous. I'm saying we need to start owning
D issues if we want D to succeed, as opposed to asking people to
implement their own suggestions. That means taking feedback from folks
like Manu or Dicebot as "things we should work on" as opposed to "if you
want it done please do it".
I understand that's counterintuitive but I really think it's the way
forward. We need to evolve from a tribe to an organization.
And regardless of your answer to that question, what do you see as
"success" for D and how do you plan to get there, given what you know
now?
Success is like adult content - you know it when you see it :o). I don't
think defining it by means of 1-2 simple proxies (downloads, companies
using D, etc) is very meaningful but it's clear to me we're not
successful yet.
It's possible that it's already a success for the community, as it
works well enough for the thousands using and handful contributing to
it, and they do not see your million-user goal as worth putting effort
into.
I'm sure most of us hope broader support for D is highly desirable.
I'll note that I'd like to see D reach a million users, and I'm doing my
small part by trying to get it on the gigantic Android install base, but
my desire and single new port doesn't mean much since those will not be
enough to get D to a million, and I'm not interested in working on
Windows tooling or some other issues that might get it there.
Similarly, whatever the definition of success is, whether yours or the
community's, it's meaningless without a plan and a push to get there. I
know you can't make people follow your plan, assuming you have one (not
a dig, you just may not know how to get to a million yet), but you can
still sketch out some specific efforts that you'd like to enable (more
user bounties or better ways to get input from commercial users or a
much-improved GC, which you have said you'd push for in a reddit
comment) or put out a public agenda/roadmap you'd like to see prioritized.
Without some purposeful steps in the direction of your "success," the D
community is unlikely to randomly amble along towards where you're
hoping, at least not in the next couple decades. ;)
I agree, a plan is needed. Walter and I just had a long talk about this.
We hope to flesh things out better soon.
Andrei
