If you speak both languages, there's no reason not to subscribe to both
lists. And maybe occasionally cross-post bilingually. :) (This goes for all
language-specific lists, in my opinion.) I, however, continue to feel that
One List to Rule Them All is a poor approach.
I honestly think that in the scheme of things, those who are totally unable
to participate in the English-language lists are a small percentage. (I'd be
happy to see numbers showing what the make-up is in the average open-source
project, but I've never found any!) However, those who prefer to communicate
in their native tongue, or are more effective in communicating with their
native language probably makes up a much more sizeable number. (And we've
certainly seen that Spanish-speakers are vocal so far!)
However, think about some of the things which are likely to be discussed on
a language-specific list:
* Localization
* Translation
* Local evangelism
* Support
With the exception of the last one (provided it's not something of a FAQ),
there's probably nothing to be gained by ensuring that the communication is
done in English. And, again, if it's of general interest, there's nothing to
stop someone from crafting a bilingual (or perhaps multilingual, in the
future) cross-posting. (Even if the bilingual part is thanks to a
translation service, though I'd hope that the submitter of that message
would be kind enough to tell the recipients so that they could understand
why the language was odd.)
Again, just my thoughts on the matter.
--Matt
P.S. Garrett had requested that the español list be set up. Is there an ETA
on that? :)
P.P.S. When it comes time to write the rules of mailing lists, may I suggest
the following? "All posts to any list should be in either UTF-8 or US-ASCII,
unless specified otherwise on the list's information page. These two
character sets should be handled properly by almost any mail client. UTF-8
is preferred." This will help prevent character set issues. ;) For some
languages, that is an important thing to have spelled out. Unfortunately,
not every mail reader is smart enough to do character set conversions yet,
as we saw during the past few days.
--
Matt Lewandowsky
Big Geek
Greenviolet
[email protected] http://www.greenviolet.net
+1 415 578 5782 (US) +44 844 484 8254 (UK)
+86 755 33944325 (CN) +39 02 8715 7053 (IT)
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Gabriel de la Cruz" <[email protected]>
Date: Friday, 06 August, 2010 0:59
To: "Matt Lewandowsky" <[email protected]>
Cc: "Joerg Schilling" <[email protected]>;
<[email protected]>; <[email protected]>; <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [illumos-Discuss] [Discuss] IE? (Illumos En Español)
Hi
Actually for the ones speaking both languages it is nice to receive
them at once, if someone needs a hint about what what is going on,
please just ask, I guess we could highlight if there is any important
subject coming up on either side. I would suggest just to skip the
Spanish comments and keep reading the posts, do the same as you do
when compiling kernels; if you don't understand what it means, don't
mess with it, and you wont panic ;-D
-Google translate works very well, just as a hint.
-Do not hesitate to ask if you need to translate something to the other
team
We are building some Babel tower, in order to get closer and closer to
the SUN ;-)
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 2:32 AM, Matt Lewandowsky <[email protected]>
wrote:
Likewise, not everyone can speak English. (Sadly, this includes some
people who claim it as their native tongue, but that's hopefully
irrelevant here.)
So, how I see it is as follows: If the project doesn't accommodate
non-English speakers, they'll either ignore the project and/or they may
splinter off the radar. I've seen this happen with other open source
projects, where there's a group of people speaking another language who
have a superset (of sorts) of the main codebase, managed as a separate
project as it had been decreed that all communication on the main
project's lists must be in English. They inevitably end up forking or
dying (with their enhancements never ending up in the upstream codebase,
usually due to a form of NIH combined with the sheer size of the
patchset), as they don't have any value as a separate project with simply
locale-based changes.
It benefits no one, especially if it's a huge codebase like this. If they
want an official mechanism to communicate in their native language, I say
go for it. The only other fair solution is to make this list
multilingual, which bring us back to your original complaint: you don't
speak Spanish. ;) Do you want to be stuck reading multi-lingual posts
here, do you want them to have an officially-sanctioned place to
collaborate, or do you want to force them into a self-run state where
they may be forced to create a derivative project?
While avoiding "every possible group gets at least one list", it's easy
to fall into the trap at the other end of the spectrum: insufficient
number of lists.
Just my US$0.02. (I know that it's worth less than ever, but humor me.
:) )
--Matt Lewandowsky
Greenviolet
Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.
-----Original Message-----
From: Joerg Schilling <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2010 11:56
To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [illumos-Discuss] [Discuss] IE? (Illumos En Español)
Hernan Saltiel <[email protected]> wrote:
> Hi, Garrett!
> As you can read in the previous emails, the Spanish speaking community
is
> very interested in having a mailing list in your site where to post
doubts
> and collaborate in our own language.
> And maybe, of course, translate the site in the future ;-) .
> Is there any chance to have this list in IllumOS.org, with a name like
> "illumos-es" or "discuss-es", for example?
I believe that having different "clubs" for different languages would
separate
the community.
I don't speak spanish, so how would I know what has been discussed in a
spanish
mailing list?
Jörg
--
EMail:[email protected] (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353
Berlin
[email protected] (uni)
[email protected] (work) Blog:
http://schily.blogspot.com/
URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/
ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily
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