Josh, I agree with you that, to make VO Jaws-like, would take away
the uniqueness of VoiceOver. In 2000, when I first learned the
Windows operating system, I used a screenreader called ASAW
(Automatic Screen Access for Windows), and were it not for the fact
Larry Scutchan couldn't ge support from the BVI community, he
couldn't "run with the big dogs", which is too bad, because I felt
this system was far superior to Jaws. I've used ASAW, Jaws, Window-
Eyes, Supernova, outSpoken for both Mac and Windows, and a product
called Winvision, for Windows 95, by Artic. VersaBraille, BNS,
Braille Lite, Type Lite, and Braille Note are the only braille
devices I've used. I have a Braille Lite 18, which I can't use for
anything except writing a daily journal, because of its limited
storage capacity. Two years ago, at the Las Vegas convention, I
almost bought a Braille Note Classic, but decided against it at the
last minute. All this to say, no matter how good VoiceOver will
become, there are going to be those skeptics out there in the BVI
community who, no matter what you do to demonstrate VoiceOver's
viability, they are not going to change any time soon because they
have been told that Jaws or any other Windows screenreader being
used, is the best they can get. I suppose there is nothing wrong
with that thinking, except it limits users' flexibilities and they
may never get the chance to explore some other things out there. I
would never have learned about Spoken Interface or VoiceOver, except
that I read an article sent to me by a friend of mine who is,
herself, a Mac user here in Alaska. To my knowledge, she is not a
member of this list, although I encouraged her to join us, when she
got her Mac Book from our local store. Richie Gardenhire, Anchorage,
Alaska.
On Apr 16, 2007, at 10:17 AM, Josh de Lioncourt wrote:
On Apr 16, 2007, at 10:38 AM, Joshue O Connor wrote:
I agree with John, there are many users who would consider going
over to
the Mac if VO was more JAWS like or at least to convince them - VO
would
probably have to do what JFW does and then some. Aside from its
direct
interaction with the OS its limitations with web browsing/application
support would deter people. However many JFW and other screen reader
users I know would be very interested in switching to VO and possibly
will in the future, but the consensus seems to be, whether true or
not,
is that VO is not quite there yet. Though I know users who prefer the
'feel' of VO to JFW. We will wait to see what Leopard delivers
and take
it from there.
Actually, I've found that this is a mentality of JFW users in
general. Window-Eyes, though a superior screen reader in my
opinion, is definitely the underdog, mainly because JFW users are
often unwilling to even try Window-Eyes. They believe that JFW is
the better screen reader, and that WE is awful, and nothing you can
say will convince many of them. WE and VO both suffer from a
massive amount of false information being propigated through the VI
community, which is particularly dentrimental in a minority group
that relies as much as the VI one does on word-of-mouth. I think
the Access World article publishedon VO could be fairly summarized
as saying, "It's not Jaws, therefore it sucks." That was one of
the most horrible pieces of so-called journalism I've ever read
where regards access technology.
The reason for this mentality is up for debate, but in the end it
doesn't really matter. I used to be a huge advocate for Jaws, and
then I found other sollutions that, when fairly judged against it,
stood up better in the overall picture, and also in the areas for
which I needed my screen reader to perform well.
I think making VO more "Jaws-like" would defeat its usefulness in
many respects. Yes, there are some commands that I'd like to see
introduced in VO that are included in Windows screen readers at
present. But VO is a very strong tool as it is now, if one takes
the time to learn to use it properly.
And, I should probably also point out that this sort of thinking is
not exclusive to Jaws users. On the contrary, this seems to be a
relatively common problem in the VI community. I remember 15 years
ago or so, many blind people swearing by their Braille'n'Speaks,
even though there were far better devices out there. The BnS had
been well marketed and word-of-mouth spread that it was the best
there was, when in fact several other, better, products existed.
Convincing a BnS user to try something else was like pulling
teeth...I know, because I used a lot of the other types of
products. I've always been one to try everything I can get my
hands on, and make an informed decision. Over the years I've used,
just to name a few, JFW, WE, VO, outSpoken for Windows, outSpoken
for Mac, outSpoken 98, Eureka A4, Aria, Braille Note,
Braille'n'Speak, Braille Lite, Braille Note, KeyNote, Type'n'Speak,
Pocket Braille, and dozens of others, all to quite an extent. Most
blind people say, "What should I use?" and then get whatever they
are told is the best, without any real knowledge of whether it
really is right for them.
Stepping off my soapbox now. *grin*
