On Sat, Jan 31, 2009 at 7:47 PM, Kathy Dopp <kathy.d...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Sat, Jan 31, 2009 at 12:03 PM, Raph Frank <raph...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>> Again what is your view on condorcet methods and approval? > > Obviously most other voting methods, approval, range, condorcet, etc. > are worlds superior to IRV/STV because they are precinct-summable, > monotonic, and treat all ballots equally. Almost any method that has > been proposed is far far superior, more equitable, and fairer than > IRV/STV.
Well, I would disagree that plurality is better than IRV. IRV is slightly better (or at worse, they are both equally bad). I think that there are lots of methods that are better than both plurality and IRV, like approval and condorcet methods. Also, I think PR-STV is one of the best multi-seat PR methods. I think the benefits of PR-STV in terms of giving the voters maximum power, outweigh non-monotonic effects. What would be your view of single non-transferable vote? This is the method where each voter votes for one candidate and the N candidates with the highest vote are elected. This is the multi-winner version of plurality. Actually, even if surplus transfers were performed, it would still be monotonic (your vote would always go to your top ranked candidate unless he is elected). It is only the elimination part of PR-STV that causes the non-monotonic effects. In IRV, voting for your favourite might case your 2nd favourite to be eliminated and then your favourite loses in the last round to your least favourite. > False statement. My vote will either have a 100% chance of helping my > first choice candidate or a 100% chance of hurting my first choice > candidate, depending on how all other voters vote, which I cannot tell > without being God, which most voters are not. So I have no way when > voting of knowing for certain how to vote to help my favorite > candidate win. Should I rank my favorite first, last or not at all to > help him? No way to know. Well, I guess it depends on what you know. Prior to the election, you don't know the effect of each possible vote you could cast. After the election, you could work out if your vote backfired. However, in almost all cases, it would turn out that the winning margin was more than 1 vote, anyway. I think in practice, the situation would be that there are 2 major party candidates and lots of small parties. In that situation, you would be pretty safe voting honestly, just make sure you rank one of the top 2 somewhere on your ballot. The small party candidates will be eliminated first and then the last round will be between the 2 contenders (or one of the top-2 will pass the 50% threshold before the last round). IRV doesn't handle a situation where there are 3 front-runners very well. In that case, there is no easy way to know how to vote. ---- Election-Methods mailing list - see http://electorama.com/em for list info